Unknown - Lex Fridman 知识图谱

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or whatever.

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I've done this for 16 years, I was number one in the world for like eight years straight,

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all time world records.

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And I'm like, I'm not going to do that anymore.

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What I want to do is just something deep down to me that is really important.

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And there's three things that were driving this.

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And this is a five year journey that I went through to do this.

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I really wanted to showcase that you could do something that is well beyond the scope

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of what people think is humanly possible.

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So just this inspiration thing, this grand over the top, like if you set your mind to

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a single minded goal, you can go so much further.

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And I didn't even say what the goal was upfront, because it was so far out there, I would have

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been laughed at.

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And that's, I think big goals should be kept pretty damn close to start with for that reason

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too.

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But and then the second piece was to walk the walk to show like the principles of what

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I believed in around human movement, the ability to manage and control the spinal mechanics

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and the output that can have on the body.

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And so I wanted to take the two most basic movements that every able bodied person should

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be able to do.

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So fundamental movement patterns, the squat, which is like, in the developmental approach

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is around nine months as a baby from a developmental kinesiology standpoint, and a really basic

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pattern that every able bodied person should be able to master the other one being the

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hip hinge, being able to pick something up off the ground, a deadlift.

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And I wanted to do those two, not just one, because I wanted to show the principles that

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I wasn't built for one, I wasn't a specialist because of my lever links, torso links, all

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that, any outliers, because nobody had ever done a thousand pound squat.

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So this is it is and a thousand pound deadlift.

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It was outside of the scope of what anybody's there's like half a dozen people that have

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done one or the other, but nobody's ever done both.

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And I wanted to do something unique.

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I wanted to do them, not only do it, but do them for reps to leave literally no question

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out there.

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And there's no competition for that.

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So it was this is what I'm going to go do.

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And to pull it off, I had some past issues with my elbows and stuff that I couldn't work

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around.

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So I had to wear straps, which was another reason I couldn't do it in the competition

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setting.

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So the first year I worked up and I did a thousand and two pound deadlift plates were

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weighed afterwards.

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It was a couple a little bit over and I did it for almost three reps.

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And that still stands as a Guinness world record.

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Just the one rep does is the most weight ever sumo deadlifted.

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And one other person has deadlifted a thousand for reps at this point.

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And that was a Thor Bjornsson from Game of Thrones.

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He's done a thousand for a double as well.

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So then the next four years and I did a bunch of feats of strength on the way, but it was

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all about building that axial loading capacity, the strength that because now I'm moving the

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weight from my hands up to my shoulders.

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And so to do it for reps is like so much harder than a single like five to 10 seconds versus

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30 plus seconds to be able to buffer and manage all that with that kind of load is just crazy.

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So it's literally about the duration that your body is carrying the load.

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Yeah, that's a big part of it.

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Yeah, because you have to you're using the resource of the diaphragm for stabilization.

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And so it it's also responsible for respiration and all this other stuff.

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So even when you're not squatting, you've got to be handling those loads.

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Just holding that weight is fascinating.

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It's like it's fascinating that the human body can do that, can can maintain that structure,

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just everything working together, that the biology, the skeletal structure, the the musculature

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on top of that can hold the weight.

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It's fascinating to watch.

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Everything is very intentful about positioning and how you're creating pressure and all this

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sort of stuff, especially for me.

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So when I mentioned that half a dozen people have squatted it and half a dozen people have

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deadlifted it.

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You understand those people all weigh three hundred and eighty to four hundred and forty

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pounds.

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I weighed to sixty five to two eighty five, depending on where I was between the two.

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So there's that as well.

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Right.

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So big, big difference.

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And over the course of that, I did a lot of other feats of strength that fit in that capacity.

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And we can skip over those.

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But that was hugely invested as far as, you know, what I put into being able to accomplish

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that, because it's it's over the top, which means the other stuff had to shift and I had

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to learn.

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There's so many things that came into place to pull that off.

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And so, yeah, last March, two days before the world shut down, I did it.

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It was supposed to be at the largest equipment exhibition in the world down in San Diego

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as an event.

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And that got shut down a week beforehand, obviously.

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So we moved to let's do it in my gym and invite people.

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And that was on a Saturday and Thursday or Friday, they limited it to twenty five people

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for gatherings.

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I did it on Saturday and then Monday, everything shut down.

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So it was kind of surreal for timing wise.

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Right.

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And so if I hadn't done it, it would have never got done like because I I'd pushed to

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the limit.

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I couldn't come back and do it.

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It was at the total limitation of my capabilities.

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So I'm pretty I'm pretty proud of it.

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And the last piece was a every one of these feats along the way.

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I collaborated with a charity that I believed in.

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And there was a lot of those tied to my life story, which we probably will get into.

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So it was threefold.

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So that inspiration piece, inspiration, motivation, walking the walk and showing like just these

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methodologies that a guy that had to learn to walk again can do something like this with

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no back pain.

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So if you if you there is a way.

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And the third one is is to provide awareness and recognition around a lot of key charities.

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So so your heart was in this journey, but also your mind is just you're like a scholar

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of strength, a scientist of strength, an engineer of strength for reps do a thousand pounds

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squat and deadlift.

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Let's first talk through the actual day you did it.

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What does it take to lift that much for reps?

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The day of is really easy.

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The really the lift itself.

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Other than a few seconds is really easy and not challenging.

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People always ask me, what was it like?

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How beat up were you after that?

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And the deadlift.

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And the simple fact is, it was easy.

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The work to get there was horrendous.

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So so even the psychology of the day you weren't there was not a fear.

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There was not a nervousness.

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There is not a doubt in your mind.

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There were certainly doubts on that day from some training history.

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So there was some major breaks to my confidence in the couple months leading up where I had

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issues with passing out under the bar.

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So completely losing consciousness.

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And this was on weight less than a thousand pounds even.

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So that was like all this buildup in me going, what if what if I think I have this resolved?

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But what if I get up there and I can't even do a rep?

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How embarrassing will this be that I've been talking about this and planning for this for

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so long?

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But outside of that, I knew I could do it.

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In fact, I wanted to do even more even up to the second rep.

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Training is about, you know, working into a fatigue state.

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So you're building an amount of fatigue in your system.

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And then when you let off of it, that's when you get a compensation.

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And that's how you stairstep training.

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This is periodization.

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But leading into a big event, you're accumulating this massive amount of fatigue.

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And so I was performing at a level that I could do it.

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And so I knew I was going to be able to on me because then you then you give yourself

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that window to be able to recover and supercompensate and be able to do a little bit more.

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So like that first rep when I did it strengthwise, I went, I could do this for five reps like

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it went through my head.

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I'm like feeling I mean, it was easy and it was fast and it felt like amazing.

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And I'm like, I'm going to crush this.

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And then set rep to the realization kicked in as like, oh, this is for reps with a thousand

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pounds on your back.

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And you're fatiguing just like and then the third one was every last thing I could muster

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to just finish.

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I mean, I just barely got it done because it's the strength is like there.

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But like that capacity to be able to manage all those resources for that amount of time

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because not just leg strength when we're talking about this stuff.

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So what does it take to go from the from I don't know what like from five hundred to

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a thousand?

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That feels like a journey that's like exponential.

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It's it gets exponentially harder.

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It does.

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In the early 2000s, like I said, I started lifting in 1988.

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But my first meet in the early 2000s, my my max deadlift was five twenty three and my

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first squat was five hundred and fifty.

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So that's the heck of a journey.

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It is a journey for people that like to lift.

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What should they understand about the difference between doing five hundred and a thousand in

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terms of the actual lift that you were experiencing that day in terms of the mechanics, in terms

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of all the things you have to be like the neurological adaptation?

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You mentioned the breathing, the core strength, like techniques, like little tricks, psychological

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tricks, anything that kind of stands out to you.

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The level of intent and the opportunity for error are at a different level.

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So just the minutest changes of position by quarter inch, half inch can be make or break

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at that level.

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So these things, everything gets amplified.

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So the ability to start with having the pelvis just in the right orientation to the diaphragm

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before we start initiating what we call the the eccentric loading of the abdominal cavity

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to create this intra abdominal pressure of working against this outward expansion, working

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against the outer sheath of abdominal thoracolumbar musculature obliques, causing the co contraction

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at the pelvic floor, all this stuff and how you cue that because you can't think about

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all this stuff.

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You need to break it down and distill and practice to like it's one simple cue that

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we now lock down and control this torso stability because this is what these fundamental movements

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are about, is being able to control our spinal mechanics and then now be able to maintain

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that while articulating the joints around that through a range of motion and then using

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the main power drivers.

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So in this instance, both instances, it's the, you know, the hip complex to generate

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that power and transfer it from how we're rooted and connected to the floor through

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to the distal end, you know, which would be the barbell on the shoulder.

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You know, there's a couple key concepts.

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So one is that what we just talked through is how to actually maintain that stability.

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So if you have either the diaphragm, so which is connected at the rib cage.

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So out of alignment in any position, it needs to be in alignment with the pelvic, the pelvis.

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So those two in opposition.

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So this is simple engineering here because what we're going to do is eccentrically load

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this.

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We're going to use the diaphragm just like you would in a diaphragm pump where it's going

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to press down on all the tissue in there.

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So we're not using breath.

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So our breath was actually a lot of times a default pattern when people do that because

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they'll bring it into their chest and raise their rib cage.

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So what we want to do is just initiate the diaphragm air can be used as well over the

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top at the final to create just a little bit more downward pressure.

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But if we have out of alignment there, we have a pressure leak where it's going to be

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push out the front or the rear if you're either inflection or extension.

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All right.

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And then that causes this co contraction and all this pressure of the organs essentially

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against outward against all those tissue for the co contraction as well as surrounding

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the spine to be able to stabilize that.

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And then it puts all the muscles on both sides of the body in what we call the best length

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tension relationship.

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So if you think about a curl and we reach our arm out at the extended length, our bicep

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is not as strong and then all the way in the curl position, it's not in strong.

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There's somewhere in here that's this control of both.

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And so when you're sitting there arched or bent over, we have muscles that are past either

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one of those ranges.

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So they've got a lot of tension, which then will create relaxation on the other side.

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Right.

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So we want to have an all of that needs to be working.

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And now the next important thing is the foot.

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So it's actually this connection to the ground and how we're actually using the foot and

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ankle complex to grab and grip this connection to the ground and elicit an effect.

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And because of this and then the everything between will naturally kind of do what it

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needs to do.

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So people like to focus on it, knee position or how far out their hips are or all this

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other stuff, which is outputs of this.

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So if we control the torso and the knee, the only thing that can happen from that point

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is for the squat to happen.

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All right.

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So this allows us to use this massive, you know, the hip complex for all the muscles

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around that that are built to drive through hip extension to complete the squat.

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I did actually miss one thing in there.

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So this torso people often miss the lat is a spinal stabilizer as well.

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So that's key in controlling function at the the T.L. Junction, which is just above the

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lumbar spine.

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So kind of right opposite where your sternum is and you'll see people kind of roll over

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sometimes like an Olympic squad or something like that, where they lose position.

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And that's often because they're close grip because you can't engage the lats very well

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that way and they're pushing up in the bar.

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But you want to be able to drive and pull the bar to your center.

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And that's going to create and use the lats now to drive and connect the shoulder into

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this.

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We're kind of compressing and tightening all this stuff towards that center to create that

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entire torso stability.

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So I was using torso stability, not just core stability in my conversation earlier.

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Torsus.

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OK, so there's all these like modules of the body then connected to the grounding with

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like your feet on the ground.

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Everything you're speaking to.

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How do you work each of those modules?

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Is this over time you kind of develop the feel that ultimately boils down to this one

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simple cue that you mentioned?

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Or do you can you like literally study each particular module in yourself and see how

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it affects the lift?

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So the best way and I believe it's because I hate just like people getting out and just

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doing just movement stuff and not actually adding load because we only adapt when there's

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load.

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Maybe we can get some, you know, some proprioception or awareness of position and other stuff,

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doing some some corrective patterns and other stuff.

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But this is basic physiology is that there must be an imposed demand for us to have adaptation.

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And this is mental.

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This is emotional.

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This is all these areas.

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But and people miss that.

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So I prefer to be able to look at a person and this is our methodology and do the assessment

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in any basic loaded movement.

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So with developing an eye for that, you can actually see and go, OK, we've got a fault

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pattern right here in the foot and use a cue or a set of cues.

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Doesn't really matter till we find the one that works and bring that.

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And now we know we want to simplify this stuff.

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I just walk through.

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That sounds really complicated.

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And it it is if we try to break down and distill it all.

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But like, let's just find the basic stuff that gets us in the range, start working and

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then find the next as we add load.

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Now we find where's our next area that we're starting to fault that and then go there again

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next.

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So this is what we do, what we teach in our educational platform.

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So we are the only I believe everybody wants to do a lot of these like assessments, you

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know, on a bench, on a table body.

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And it's like, no, let's let's go squat.

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Let's go deadlift.

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If you do strongman and it's a yoke carry, let's yoke carry because these are basic human

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fundamentals.

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It's not powerlifting like this is how we function.

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This is why we we work with 29 of the 30 major league baseball teams and 90 percent of all

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professional sports out there in North America.

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Sorry, although we do some work with Tour de France and other stuff as well.

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And North America, I do mean hockey, too.

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But these principles like, you know, if if the Dodgers won't bring us in, they're not

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learning how to power lift.

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You know, we're going to obviously will probably be do we do a little bit more shoulder focus

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than hip focus with their athletes or their coaches.

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We're usually working with the coaches, not the athletes.

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And so you help them.

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And then the same thing on yourself to understand the role that these different muscle groups

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have.

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Yes.

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On the holistic.

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Yeah.

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So it's all about getting the joints in the appropriate position so that we can do that.

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We can manage load so that we're not putting undue stress on the joint.

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We're getting the proper link tension.

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We're getting these basic fundamental things with the body.

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And so the the largest global impact that you will have is through spinal mechanics.

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I can't look at a shoulder if I'm not managing this because it's your spine.

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So for those who are just listening, like I'm arching and then and then flexing, that's

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What we want to think about is there's a lot of different frames of thought, some very

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classical, maybe not classical Russian approach because there's a lot of different approach

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from the Eastern block, but one of the ones is developing all the qualities at once, focusing

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on building those more of a periodization effect would be focusing on one quality at

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a time or one quality while maintaining other qualities and then shifting that around.

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So it's just going to be a little different based on what the output is and what the desired.

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So like powerlifting is actually, power is the wrong word.

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There's actually no power in it.

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It's just brute, it's, it's strength, um, application of force, um, Olympic lifting

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would actually be a better name for powerlifting because that is more explosive development.

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There's um, strongman is again, now we're getting a little bit more athletic.

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It's equipment based on the implements and stuff that are used, how fast you can move

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your feet and run mixed with more endurance, but still very strength focused.

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And there's some things with strongman that is straight.

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Like each one of these is very also focused on different genetic dispositions.

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So actually if you look at the history of sports, you'll find that they're a lot of

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times based on different populations and it sounds like it's very unPC, but like a Highland

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games, um, they've got deep, deeper hip sockets that are shallow.

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So you're going to see a lot of short hip hinge movements like the, the caber toss and

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things like that.

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Muay Thai wrestling, they've got a completely different hip joint.

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And so strongman itself is going to be for very large frame individuals.

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If you're not well over six foot and a large person, you're probably not going to perform

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well.

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It's sub six foot have ever done well at strongman just because it's, it's leverage based, right?

Guest (1:01:54.200)

Um, Olympic lifting, we see consistently in, in Europe, uh, the, the history tells us a

Guest (1:02:01.560)

high level of hip, uh, and back issues because of the depth that that hip socket has to go

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in to be able to complete that lift.

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And so you're going to see issues with populations that don't have the ability to do that.

Guest (1:02:15.920)

So, so we've talked a little bit about training as well as disposition.

Guest (1:02:20.280)

Yeah.

Guest (1:02:21.280)

So, and also cross head fits into that, that's more like strongman, but for a wider variety

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of bodies, I suppose.

Guest (1:02:27.440)

Yep.

Guest (1:02:28.440)

And definitely more metabolic conditioning focus than the, than the strength aspect of

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it.

Guest (1:02:33.000)

Um, and, and, and conditioning is an interesting thing too.

Guest (1:02:36.600)

So that quality in my opinion can be developed a lot faster, but kind of peaks much faster

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as well.

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Um, where strength, we can continue to add and add and add over time.

Guest (1:02:48.920)

Uh, so it's for me, like for conditioning with any strength athlete, I don't like to

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spend as much time on that.

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So I'll cycle, uh, the conditioning work for our strength athletes and then taper that

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off leading into meat.

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So the more metabolic work, that means the more capacity in strength training that you

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can accomplish, which is the goal, um, and recover from.

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But then as we lead to a competition, we want to spend more time on recovering from that.

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So we have to pull things out.

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So we'd pull out less.

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So like a typical approach would be like taking a six week cycle for conditioning and ramping,

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ramping up over three weeks periods time, then dropping back down again and ramping

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up and being slightly offset by like a week or two from your strength peaks so that you've

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actually tapered the week prior in your conditioning work to your strength work.

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Right.

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So we're not hitting conditioning hard all the time, which is a common, common, uh, misstep

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that people make is going, well, I need conditioning.

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So they just hammer that at a base level over the top instead of cycling that.

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If we talk about powerlifting in terms of regimen, in terms of exercise, in terms of

Guest (1:04:01.280)

the process, the wood consistent with what, is there something to be said about general

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qualities of the consistency of the regimen required to get strong?

Guest (1:04:10.360)

Yes.

Guest (1:04:11.360)

So let's talk about some training principles as a whole.

Guest (1:04:16.400)

And this will, I think this will break down what you're, what you're one, the more work

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that we can fit into a given time, the more progress we're going to make.

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But that doesn't mean doing the max amount of work possible at any given time.

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So we know that we're always to, to, to accomplish more, we're always going to have more.

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And there's a certain ceiling that you're going to hit that you're not going to be able

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to add more.

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So you want to start and get the most amount of results that you can with the least amount

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of work, because you're going to have to do it again, like this stair step over and over

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year, decade, so on.

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So when people is a big miss, people got, they look at a Chico program from Russia or

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so on and they go, I'm going to follow this.

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It's like that was specifically written for somebody with 20 years of experience that's

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already built the capacities to be at that level.

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So it's all about building that work capacity.

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So how much work can you give in a given time?

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So now we want to look at some research is it relates to injuries because injuries are

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going to be a big driver over time of what holds you back.

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So when we talk consistency, training hard for three years, five years, it's going to

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be really good.

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But what we find is a lot of people train really hard for nine months, have to slow

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back for a month, get back into it and miss another week because, and so on.

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They're always like this little nagging, that little nagging.

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And so it's pretty clear in the research we want to, we're looking at when we're stair

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stepping this stuff, we're looking at acute and chronic loading.

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So some fancy words for average and like what's happening right now.

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So this given week would be our acute, chronic would be what is our average loading let's

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say over the last six months.

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So the more that we can move the chronic loading up, the more work we're getting done on as

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a whole over time, we're going to get stronger.

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The way that we build the capacity to do that is having spikes in acute loading.

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Now as we do this, the, the acute loading, if it spikes more than 10, maybe 15% from

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what the chronic loading has been, that accounts for 80% of injuries out there.

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So it's not actually the movement quality or this misstep or the other may usually happens

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about four or five, six weeks later, it's like, Oh, this nagging and then it gets worse.

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And then now you got to, you got to do some rehab, your training sessions aren't as good

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and so on.

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So now we're starting to look at this.

Guest (1:06:54.640)

Okay.

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It's like, I want to do the, I want to do the least amount of work where I can still

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progress.

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I want to be able to have spikes in my weekly demand that don't go above 10 to 15% of what

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I've been averaging for the last month.

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But every time I do a spike, my, my average goes up, right?

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Boom, boom, boom.

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And then that becomes very particular also when you take, when you do take plantain time

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off.

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So a lot of people, uh, training session, maybe they're doing a five week block with

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a, uh, a deload week or you go on vacation for a week or any of those things that were

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a downward.

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What does that do to your average and chronic loading?

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It brings it down.

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And then what does the person want to do when they come back, make up for it.

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Now they have a huge spike above five weeks later, we're dealing with all this elbow,

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this wrist, whatever's kind of bothering me and now you're not performing as much.

Guest (1:07:47.760)

So these are some really fundamental pieces of, of, of, of training.

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And then now we can start overlaying the qualities that we're trying to develop that we were

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talking about earlier.

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So now it's, let's talk about my deadlift, my thousand pound deadlift.

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We'll talk about the training cycles for both the thousand deadlift and squat.

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So backing up a year out from the deadlift, knowing I was training at the time, heavy

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deadlifts once a week and usually it was two of those sessions a month were really heavy

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and the others weren't.

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And it's like, okay, how can we get this up to where I'm deadlifting twice a week?

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Because that's where I want to be, uh, to be able to accomplish this.

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I need to be loading about that much with frequency, with a certain volume to be able

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to accomplish this goal.

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We're not going to go through all the math and stuff like that and how that's arrived,

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but there is math behind this.

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And so instead of just like, oh, well, let's start deadlifting twice a week.

Guest (1:08:41.600)

No.

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So we start and we take the one session that we've got and we split it, part of it, take

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part of it away and put it in the second half of the week.

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So the total volume is still the same.

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And then, um, we start adding some volume, but I'm doing it at a off a block so that

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the actual load is accumulative load is less cause I have less range of motion.

Guest (1:09:03.760)

Okay.

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And then we start building that closer to the ground, closer to the ground and so on.

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And now we start getting to where I'm almost doing two sessions, full sessions a week.

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And then we start adding a little bit of load.

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And so at my level, this isn't talking about adding another set or another day a week.

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We're talking like in my squat, it might be one rep instead of doing three sets of three

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at one week, I do two doubles or two triples, then two doubles to give me one more rep.

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That's it.

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And so we're doing that from one week to the next.

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And that's a cycle training cycle.

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It might be five, six weeks and then so on and the next one and slowly bringing that

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average load up.

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So the last phases of the squat, for example, we took the average loading every week.

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So my, of my heavy sets.

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Once we developed all this stuff over the last year to get to this point, now it is

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taking and going, okay, my average load this week is eight reps at nine hundred and fifty

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five pounds.

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And then the next week, let's get it to nine, nine fifty seven, nine sixty three.

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And this was pretty aggressive working up to where my average loading the final that

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the final was nine hundred and eighty five pounds average load for eight to nine reps.

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And that's what I said.

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This is the intense part.

Guest (1:10:24.120)

This is the day of was much easier that week over week is pretty brutal.

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May not sound well, you're just squatting.

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And now let's back up.

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Let's look at the quality development.

Guest (1:10:34.820)

So a year out from the squat, obviously, I've been working on developing axial load capacity,

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my capacity to withstand load from top to bottom.

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So I like thinking about things and movement vectors.

Guest (1:10:46.680)

So this vector is an axial loaded vector is the hardest to recover from that was axial.

Guest (1:10:52.340)

Like is deadlift, are they both or both?

Guest (1:10:55.440)

Yep.

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So a horizontal front to back would be like a row or a press.

Guest (1:11:01.120)

Why is the axial hardest to recover because it's entire body, the entire entire body,

Guest (1:11:06.040)

just anything that is that taxes the the spinal mechanics?

Guest (1:11:11.000)

I don't I could tell you my beliefs.

Guest (1:11:14.160)

It's studied.

Guest (1:11:15.160)

It is.

Guest (1:11:16.160)

OK, we can just keep the discussion on that short like that.

Guest (1:11:20.040)

Well, so we start looking at those different vectors that we're training in.

Guest (1:11:24.800)

And so this is why this is important to understand.

Guest (1:11:27.640)

So I'm not just getting into nuance here.

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So, hey, squatting is going to make me make me jump further because it's legs.

Guest (1:11:34.400)

Well, squatting is an axial load vector and jumping is a vector this way.

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So actually, hip thrust would help with your and this is proven in science with your forward

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jumping ability.

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They're both working similar muscles.

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The glute extension, but they're working it in those different platforms.

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So it's really important to understand because people don't understand.

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I'm building my work capacity by doing sled process.

Guest (1:12:01.440)

You're not developing your work capacity for squatting.

Guest (1:12:04.720)

Most movements, even ones as holistic as a as a squat, require specialization.

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Yeah.

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You can't get strong at the squat by doing it.

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You're going to have some carry over, right, obviously.

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But because taking an untrained person that hasn't done it is still not going to do as

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good as somebody that's done nonspecific work, but done work.

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So but yes, for the most part, to get truly strong, you need to specialize.

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So but not all the time.

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So now we talk about quality.

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So and if we specialize in the same thing too long, we stagnate because the body adapts

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to a certain point and just can't make progress.

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So we wanted to save the actual squatting in the pattern with the bar that I was doing

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for the very end.

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So starting a year out, I started doing work front squatting like a squat axial loaded

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pattern and worked on maximizing that up.

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Then I started shifting to doing transformer bar squat.

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It's this bar I developed that actually change manipulates spinal mechanics.

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So I started loading in these more forward positions and being able again.

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So now I'm getting closer than a front squat, but not quite squatting.

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And then I would start adjusting that bar every training cycle to closer to a squat

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toaster to a squat till it finally was right.

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What's the difference between a front squat and a regular like a back squat?

Guest (1:13:25.080)

Like in terms of the stress on the body, the mechanics, was there something interesting

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to be said about like how fundamentally different are they?

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So it's interesting.

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People think about the weight and imposition to them like, oh, the bars in front of me,

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the bars behind me, which is not the case.

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The bar is above your midfoot.

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The load is above your midfoot.

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So we're actually manipulating the spine behind the bar.

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So we're causing spinal uprighting behind the bar, getting in a more erect position,

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which is going to change the relationship of the hip angle.

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It's going to change our ability to maintain the spine.

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It's going to change how much the core comes in, how hard it is to maintain that sternum

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to diaphragm relationship that we talked about.

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All this stuff starts changing.

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So the bar stays in the same place.

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Bar is still behind you, but the load moves around.

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But we're actually manipulating the spine around the load.

Guest (1:14:21.240)

Yeah.

Guest (1:14:22.240)

It's incredible.

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We can tailor it to an athlete, which is great when you got a seven foot plus tall baseball

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player or basketball player.

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That's why we work with all these teams.

Guest (1:14:30.240)

Anyway, so it's like you're taking something and getting closer and closer to it.

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At the same time, we're looking at the quality.

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So like I needed to be able to really hold this torso position with the weight moving

Guest (1:14:39.260)

up here.

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Unlike the deadlift, the ability to manage this TL position becomes much more challenging.

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So that was also why I was choosing the transformer bar, because it actually challenges that more

Guest (1:14:50.080)

in those big forward positions.

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I was also working on my back strength tremendously to be able to hold the maintain position.

Guest (1:14:56.920)

So there was a lot of like I chose a bent over rows.

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So bent over row is a mixed vector.

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So it's a forward to back.

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So it wouldn't have as much carrier, but it's also got some axial loading component in it

Guest (1:15:09.280)

as well.

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So we're working on that.

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And then as we get closer and closer to competition, I'm developing those strengths.

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But now I need to start tapering those out.

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So all of my recovery needs can now go into the more specific that I'm actually ramping

Guest (1:15:22.520)

the load up.

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So as I'm ramping the load on the weight, I'm able to ramp it a lot faster because I'm

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tapering out the other stuff.

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So I can still keep my total load high, but now get it very, very specific.

Guest (1:15:37.600)

So everything that I've done has always been kind of an annual training cycle.

Guest (1:15:41.200)

And then again, this was like this was a five year training cycle, but we just kind of walked

Guest (1:15:44.800)

through the last year of each and you can see how these concepts play out in reality.

Guest (1:15:50.000)

So in the cycling.

Guest (1:15:51.760)

So this is both for you, but also for more recreational strength athletes.

Guest (1:15:58.640)

Let's say there's variety injected into this.

Guest (1:16:01.480)

You need variety.

Guest (1:16:02.760)

Yeah.

Guest (1:16:03.760)

Yeah.

Guest (1:16:04.760)

So you will basically stagnate at some level, right?

Guest (1:16:07.800)

So you should always be kind of shifting a little bit.

Guest (1:16:10.600)

So three to four month blocks in general for an average, you know, just a gen pop fitness

Guest (1:16:16.920)

is pretty good where you're going to spend more time maybe in a higher rep range or lower

Guest (1:16:22.040)

rep range, a little bit more work on endurance capacity or maybe some more time.

Guest (1:16:27.000)

Hey, I'm playing around with boxing or jujitsu or something like that.

Guest (1:16:30.280)

Bring that a little bit more to the front for a while and bring the other out.

Guest (1:16:33.280)

But like mixing mixing those variables up, but trying to keep the total load the same

Guest (1:16:38.320)

and always kind of like, you know, do we add a little more?

Guest (1:16:41.200)

Again, it doesn't have to be major and it shouldn't be major.

Guest (1:16:43.640)

You don't want these big jumps.

Guest (1:16:44.740)

You don't go, oh, my God, let's move.

Guest (1:16:48.280)

Let's jump into squatting every day.

Guest (1:16:51.520)

You've got to build the capacity to do that.

Guest (1:16:54.360)

It's simple.

Guest (1:16:55.960)

What role would you say strength has in sports that combine skill and strength?

Guest (1:17:01.760)

So for me personally, maybe I'll just ask it selfishly, which is grappling, wrestling,

Guest (1:17:07.640)

MMA.

Guest (1:17:08.640)

Yeah.

Guest (1:17:09.640)

How about I start with baseball?

Guest (1:17:12.640)

Please.

Guest (1:17:13.640)

No.

Guest (1:17:14.640)

I will.

Guest (1:17:15.640)

OK.

Guest (1:17:16.640)

I know.

Guest (1:17:17.640)

The sport.

Guest (1:17:18.640)

OK.

Guest (1:17:19.640)

No.

Guest (1:17:20.640)

Baseball and golf are two of my favorite sports.

Guest (1:17:21.640)

Oh, no.

Guest (1:17:22.640)

I don't.

Guest (1:17:23.640)

You don't have to be in shape at all to excel at those sports.

Guest (1:17:25.800)

Well, here's the thing.

Guest (1:17:26.800)

There we go.

Guest (1:17:27.800)

It doesn't help.

Guest (1:17:28.800)

I'm going to get this argument.

Guest (1:17:29.800)

Well, I've got a perfect example, because this is why I sell so many Transformer bars

Guest (1:17:34.320)

into the Major League Baseball.

Guest (1:17:36.340)

So they get these people that come in, these athletes, that have been baseball their whole

Guest (1:17:42.320)

life.

Guest (1:17:43.320)

It is part of the culture.

Guest (1:17:44.780)

And so they're great athletes.

Guest (1:17:46.400)

They've got all this skill.

Guest (1:17:47.920)

The only thing they have to do is develop a little bit more resilience so that they

Guest (1:17:53.520)

don't have the injury.

Guest (1:17:54.760)

They can push their training a little bit more, that they can add a little bit more

Guest (1:17:58.720)

force output and be able to recover from it.

Guest (1:18:01.760)

So the only thing they've got to do is add some training.

Guest (1:18:04.860)

But there's no training culture there, so they don't have any experience, which is why

Guest (1:18:08.480)

they love the Transformer bar, because they don't have to worry about teaching the technique.

Guest (1:18:11.900)

We can actually set the bar on a setting that makes their squats perfect by cueing all the

Guest (1:18:15.200)

stuff with actually not having to coach it.

Guest (1:18:17.380)

Because when you're coaching a roomful of athletes, it's really hard to teach the nuance

Guest (1:18:21.020)

of all this and not sure that all that.

Guest (1:18:23.000)

But that's all that they have to do with these players with a huge level of skill.

Guest (1:18:27.400)

So once you reach a certain level of skill, adding strength is the only real forward path.

Guest (1:18:35.520)

So that's the basic, simple answer to that.

Guest (1:18:39.640)

So one of the benefits there being injury prevention, actually.

Guest (1:18:42.600)

Injury prevention.

Guest (1:18:43.600)

Resilience.

Guest (1:18:44.600)

Because especially fighting sports, you're going to be challenged and thrown and other

Guest (1:18:49.320)

things happen to you.

Guest (1:18:50.640)

And the more resilient you can make your structures, the better you're going to be.

Guest (1:18:54.760)

Even a cyclist, mountain biking.

Guest (1:18:57.080)

Why would they need it?

Guest (1:18:58.080)

Why would they need to do upper body training?

Guest (1:18:59.480)

Take a crash, your shoulder's gone.

Guest (1:19:02.240)

You're done.

Guest (1:19:03.240)

Your career's over.

Guest (1:19:04.240)

Unless you've done a little training.

Guest (1:19:07.560)

So there's value in all this stuff.

Guest (1:19:09.120)

But the resilience, that's huge.

Guest (1:19:12.400)

And then we can overlay strength.

Guest (1:19:15.000)

Where we miss is this focus on strength when we haven't developed quality motor patterns

Guest (1:19:19.880)

first.

Guest (1:19:20.880)

So this is a huge thing with children.

Guest (1:19:23.880)

Because people want to know what's the appropriate training age.

Guest (1:19:26.880)

I'd have had my daughter training before my son.

Guest (1:19:29.800)

Because she developed movement patterns that have better quality earlier.

Guest (1:19:33.340)

There's no age.

Guest (1:19:34.340)

Because it's going to be very dependent on the individual.

Guest (1:19:37.280)

There's no point in having adaptation if we don't have the right thing to adapt to yet.

Guest (1:19:41.240)

And that applies to general movement, but also to sport.

Guest (1:19:44.120)

You're saying the skills should be developed first and then the strength applied on top

Guest (1:19:47.680)

of that.

Guest (1:19:48.680)

Yep.

Guest (1:19:49.680)

Maybe you can educate me, but I actually quit lifting and powerlifting for a long time

Guest (1:19:56.520)

after I started Judo, Jiu Jitsu, grappling, all this sort of combat sports.

Guest (1:20:05.520)

Because I found that it was preventing me from relaxing my body enough to load in the

Guest (1:20:15.520)

skill.

Guest (1:20:17.300)

So this isn't a problem with the training.

Guest (1:20:20.920)

This is a problem with you.

Guest (1:20:22.960)

So this is actually really, really important.

Guest (1:20:25.840)

The first product I ever released was a loadable mace, a swinging mace.

Guest (1:20:33.560)

And because every power lifter and body, well, not every, but most serious power lifters

Guest (1:20:38.440)

and bodybuilders, like shoulders, mobility is pretty limited.

Guest (1:20:44.480)

And most of them really, really struggle with this.

Guest (1:20:47.440)

The problem is they've been taught to have tension all the time.

Guest (1:20:52.800)

And that's not good.

Guest (1:20:53.920)

So when we talk about the joint positions that we were talking about earlier and having

Guest (1:20:57.300)

those and the muscles in the right length and tension relationship, athleticism is the

Guest (1:21:03.840)

speed to relaxation because the counter is speed to contraction.

Guest (1:21:11.080)

Float like a butterfly, sting like a bee.

Guest (1:21:14.600)

And so what a mace can do is use that because this ties back into a developmental kinesiology

Guest (1:21:20.120)

because a lot of like reset patterns are getting back into these basic movements, but it's

Guest (1:21:24.760)

as much about relaxation as it is contraction.

Guest (1:21:28.920)

So a mace, we have this weight on a big long lever.

Guest (1:21:32.500)

So if I grab a kettlebell and this would be like the same movement as a kettlebell halo,

Guest (1:21:36.440)

it is the same movement as a, but here in the halo, I'm on the whole time with the mace

Guest (1:21:42.840)

at the proper length, with the right distribution, you cannot do the movement.

Guest (1:21:47.640)

You could not move force your way through it.

Guest (1:21:50.320)

The only way that you can accomplish that is by relaxing.

Guest (1:21:55.000)

And then now we, now we can contract all the muscles related around that shoulder girdle

Guest (1:22:00.840)

all at once.

Guest (1:22:01.980)

We're working on, off, on, off, on, off with moving and contracting.

Guest (1:22:06.800)

And now, so what happens a lot of times as we, you know, this stiffness and tightness

Guest (1:22:11.880)

happens.

Guest (1:22:12.880)

So in four positions, we start using stabilizer muscles to do the movement.

Guest (1:22:17.880)

And then that's where this stiffness come from.

Guest (1:22:19.800)

So it means that in some of whatever training that you're doing, there's a deficit in the

Guest (1:22:24.960)

movement quality, okay.

Guest (1:22:27.660)

Or there's a deficit in the training program and you're not recovering from an 80% of the

Guest (1:22:31.680)

time.

Guest (1:22:32.680)

That's the right answer.

Guest (1:22:33.680)

Right.

Guest (1:22:34.680)

But yeah, that's where the, where the gap is and learning how to relax and the way a

Guest (1:22:39.440)

lot of the exercises are taught and have been taught for a long time, which is why there's

Guest (1:22:43.460)

a big gap.

Guest (1:22:44.460)

And this is why both clinical rehab and all these other components are mixed in my philosophy

Guest (1:22:49.200)

and what I'm trying to do with Kabuki strength, because I'm looking at holistic movement.

Guest (1:22:53.760)

I'm not looking at powerlifting based movements are what I want to load and be able to assess

Guest (1:22:58.560)

on.

Guest (1:23:00.680)

But this affects all sports, all activities and strength doesn't have to be that.

Guest (1:23:07.240)

I mean, I'm freaking a thousand pound squatter and deadlifter.

Guest (1:23:10.720)

If you watch any of my videos where I do like complete quad fallbacks, I don't stretch at

Guest (1:23:15.120)

all.

Guest (1:23:16.120)

I can usually get close to a full split.

Guest (1:23:17.120)

Like if I want to.

Guest (1:23:18.120)

What?

Guest (1:23:19.120)

No, I did not see those videos.

Guest (1:23:21.120)

Okay.

Guest (1:23:22.120)

That's, that's hard to believe.

Guest (1:23:23.600)

Wow.

Guest (1:23:24.600)

Okay.

Guest (1:23:25.600)

Well actually I do.

Guest (1:23:26.600)

I just did one recently, a quad fallback with my, with my mace loaded way out to the end

Guest (1:23:29.680)

torsioning on both ends of the other.

Guest (1:23:31.320)

And like I do a lot of, I do a lot of weird stuff.

Guest (1:23:35.560)

That's awesome.

Guest (1:23:36.560)

But squatting doesn't make your hips tight.

Guest (1:23:39.480)

Squatting like shit makes your hips tight.

Guest (1:23:42.880)

And so, but there is no perfect world where always our training program isn't quite perfect.

Guest (1:23:48.720)

Our movement isn't necessarily perfect.

Guest (1:23:50.840)

Like so you're going to have the needs for this stuff.

Guest (1:23:52.840)

But if you're always have to do some soft tissue work to loosen up the same one for

Guest (1:23:58.080)

that exercise, to be able to get a joint in position, there is a problem.

Guest (1:24:01.920)

And I'm not saying don't do it, do it because I don't want you to have a joint.

Guest (1:24:05.240)

Like if I can't get my shoulders in a position, I can't do overhead presses because I'm going

Guest (1:24:09.920)

to compromise my spine position.

Guest (1:24:11.080)

Then I'm going to end up with some other problems.

Guest (1:24:12.760)

Right?

Guest (1:24:13.760)

So go ahead and clean that up so you can get in position, but go figure out why it is and

Guest (1:24:18.920)

fix it.

Guest (1:24:20.460)

And then maybe next, you know, three, four months from now, they're going to get a little

Guest (1:24:23.440)

something else going on, fix it, but go understand the deeper root reason of why.

Guest (1:24:29.200)

So I'm, I believe I am the only company manufacturing and selling, you know, fascial soft tissue

Guest (1:24:35.180)

tools.

Guest (1:24:36.180)

And I'll tell you, I don't want you to use them.

Guest (1:24:39.920)

Cause it's not helping you get to the why, why it was caused in the first place.

Guest (1:24:43.880)

Yeah.

Guest (1:24:44.880)

The goal, the goal, the perfect state is not having to use them.

Guest (1:24:49.020)

Reality is you're going to have to use them from time to time because the world's not

Guest (1:24:52.080)

perfect.

Guest (1:24:53.080)

Yeah.

Guest (1:24:54.080)

So your discovery is a hundred percent on point.

Guest (1:24:56.480)

Well there's another side to combat sports when you're beginning a particular combat

Guest (1:25:02.920)

sport, strength can be a negative because human psychology, because you can get away

Guest (1:25:10.200)

with a lot when you're strong.

Guest (1:25:11.760)

Uh huh.

Guest (1:25:12.760)

Yes, you can.

Guest (1:25:13.760)

So if your mind is strong enough to where you can just turn off that advantage and be

Guest (1:25:19.680)

a beginner, truly in a particular art, that's probably the best way to do it.

Guest (1:25:23.800)

But you can get away and then you don't learn.

Guest (1:25:26.000)

Yeah.

Guest (1:25:27.000)

Yeah.

Guest (1:25:28.000)

It's hard.

Guest (1:25:29.000)

Uh, it's hard not to use the little advantages you have because like jujitsu is a big hit

Guest (1:25:35.560)

on an, on the ego for, you know, especially guys, you know, when like a smaller person

Guest (1:25:42.120)

just destroys you, dominates you when you can, uh, I don't know, deadlift whatever number

Guest (1:25:48.220)

of pounds.

Guest (1:25:50.000)

And uh, it's hard not to use that strength to then resist the slow, the ultimate destruction

Guest (1:25:56.800)

by like 120 pound, but that, and that's why I recommend developing the skill quality first,

Guest (1:26:02.560)

but it doesn't, it doesn't mean that you can't, I can't, you can still do it so that don't

Guest (1:26:06.680)

take it as a like, oh, I can't go that direction.

Guest (1:26:09.840)

That's fine.

Guest (1:26:10.840)

But understand those things and then also understand the jujitsu is additional load

Guest (1:26:14.440)

on the body.

Guest (1:26:15.480)

So you have to, you can't just add it on top.

Guest (1:26:18.680)

You've got to taper back the other, you're going to have to make a, I'm sorry, you may

Guest (1:26:22.680)

not want to hear it, but you're not going to be able to do as much and add that here.

Guest (1:26:28.960)

It's a compromise because your total volume still has to be there and there's not, unfortunately,

Guest (1:26:35.440)

not really a way to measure what the jujitsu volume is with this.

Guest (1:26:39.320)

So you've got to take a look at that and that's where like measuring like heart rate variability

Guest (1:26:44.280)

or other stuff can be useful so you can see what is happening from me from a sympathetic

Guest (1:26:50.000)

versus parasympathetic nervous system standpoint.

Guest (1:26:52.640)

Yeah.

Guest (1:26:53.640)

Making sure your body recovers sufficiently and trying to put numbers to it.

Guest (1:26:56.920)

You mentioned Kabuki strength.

Guest (1:26:58.760)

You run the Kabuki strength lab previously called the elite performance center in Oregon.

Guest (1:27:04.640)

You called it the perfect gym.

Guest (1:27:07.440)

What makes for the perfect strength training gym?

Guest (1:27:11.040)

Where I called it the perfect gym?

Guest (1:27:12.040)

In a video somewhere I watched.

Guest (1:27:14.040)

Oh man.

Guest (1:27:15.040)

I mean, that's where my testing grounds for developing all this stuff was through the

Guest (1:27:19.960)

years.

Guest (1:27:20.960)

And, and so this is, like I said, I started developing relationships with the best developmental

Guest (1:27:26.560)

kinesiologist in the, in the U S the best, arguably the best or most well known physical

Guest (1:27:30.960)

therapist in the world, the best spine biomechanist in the world.

Guest (1:27:35.240)

I started doing continuing education with these clinical courses and learning this stuff

Guest (1:27:38.880)

and going, but how does it work in my world?

Guest (1:27:41.160)

Right.

Guest (1:27:42.160)

And then I started lecturing with them and all this other stuff.

Guest (1:27:44.020)

But the lab was like, where do we test this stuff?

Guest (1:27:47.360)

Right.

Guest (1:27:48.360)

And so let me get to a point.

Guest (1:27:49.360)

There's three things.

Guest (1:27:50.360)

There's always three things.

Guest (1:27:52.480)

So to be a success, to achieve success, I believe there's three things that really,

Guest (1:27:59.720)

really come into place and it's the right methodology, the right tools and the right

Guest (1:28:08.200)

environment.

Guest (1:28:10.040)

And so it was all about building that.

Guest (1:28:13.780)

And so the methodologies came from a lot of that different, that gray area interaction

Guest (1:28:19.680)

of clinical with sports science, right?

Guest (1:28:22.520)

And then the tools I had to start creating and designing, and then the environment is

Guest (1:28:27.480)

having this, you know, focused environment of people that want to do better and push

Guest (1:28:32.220)

each other and having community and culture, right?

Guest (1:28:35.800)

I ended up building these connections, this network, everything that I'm doing with my

Guest (1:28:39.560)

businesses is trying to create that into a scalable fashion.

Guest (1:28:44.560)

And so I'm building the groundwork because to have a system that like, yeah, I had clinicals

Guest (1:28:49.200)

on site that knew exactly what we were doing.

Guest (1:28:51.480)

And when it's me and a few people in a small team and all this stuff, we're all just like

Guest (1:28:55.960)

easy to manage.

Guest (1:28:57.440)

And you can see these, there's other models around this.

Guest (1:28:59.440)

So I've been other areas since maybe whenever it was I filmed that video that said that,

Guest (1:29:04.100)

that they have that same model and it's taken probably about a decade usually to develop

Guest (1:29:09.020)

that.

Guest (1:29:10.020)

You know, and having the right people in this community, they can create this, this network

Guest (1:29:14.240)

and the tool and all this stuff, right?

Guest (1:29:15.920)

Except they still don't have the best tools because Kibuki strength didn't exist.

Guest (1:29:21.040)

But but and so out of that was, is essentially I started building this business and people

Guest (1:29:27.920)

like, when did you know how all this stuff was connected?

Guest (1:29:30.640)

And I'm like, I don't know.

Guest (1:29:32.400)

I didn't, I just started creating on the outset the things that worked until finally I'm like,

Guest (1:29:37.600)

I'm recreating a scalable version of this stuff.

Guest (1:29:41.900)

Here's the methodologies and a coaching platform that we can manage clients around the globe

Guest (1:29:46.160)

and see what's working and not based on the scientific principles of training, right?

Guest (1:29:50.160)

How do we create that into a database that now we can train new coaches and they can

Guest (1:29:54.180)

use those same metrics and tools to create programs that are tailored to fit person's

Guest (1:29:58.960)

individual needs, right?

Guest (1:30:00.720)

Now how do we integrate that with assessment and clinical care assessment and all these

Guest (1:30:06.360)

other pieces?

Guest (1:30:07.720)

So there's a lot of work in that.

Guest (1:30:09.500)

And so that's where Kibuki strength is the genesis.

Guest (1:30:11.960)

But we have, we call our gym the Kibuki strength lab.

Guest (1:30:16.760)

Literally people find about our gym in the neighborhood and they're like, how long have

Guest (1:30:20.160)

you been here?

Guest (1:30:21.160)

Why, why do I not know about this?

Guest (1:30:22.460)

We don't advertise our gym at all.

Guest (1:30:24.520)

So like that makes no sense.

Guest (1:30:27.840)

Well that's because the only reason is to have a testing environment for the tools and

Guest (1:30:32.940)

methodology and having enough people to have the culture and fit and to be able to be part

Guest (1:30:38.000)

of the experiment.

Guest (1:30:39.920)

What about the environment of the, the feel of it, the actual gym?

Guest (1:30:44.280)

There's a, I don't know, a grunginess to it.

Guest (1:30:47.360)

I recently became a member of planet fitness for, for reasons that have to do more with

Guest (1:30:54.840)

the heat in Austin that sometimes I need to put in time in the treadmill.

Guest (1:30:59.360)

I don't like that.

Guest (1:31:00.360)

I don't have any judgment, honestly.

Guest (1:31:01.360)

I don't, the best gyms I've been in are kind of dirty.

Guest (1:31:06.040)

You walk in and you know that work is to be done.

Guest (1:31:08.440)

There's not another reason to do there.

Guest (1:31:10.640)

It is the, the environment is tight.

Guest (1:31:13.560)

There's a big piece of that.

Guest (1:31:16.480)

I know it's studied sociologically, I believe.

Guest (1:31:19.040)

I just, I just pictured that word too, but the intensity, when you start growing a space,

Guest (1:31:26.080)

the intensity drops.

Guest (1:31:28.600)

And so I, I had that experience when we grew, we went from a 4,000 foot to a 9,000 square

Guest (1:31:33.080)

foot gym at one time.

Guest (1:31:35.200)

And everybody's like, it doesn't feel the same.

Guest (1:31:38.360)

Like people are complaining for years.

Guest (1:31:39.760)

We've shrunk it back down whenever down to 3,500 square feet.

Guest (1:31:42.320)

And it creates that intensity.

Guest (1:31:44.080)

It creates the closest, the connection with the people around you.

Guest (1:31:47.600)

And then like I said, the grunginess, like you go in, you know, the intention when you

Guest (1:31:52.000)

walk in that environment creates that tension.

Guest (1:31:54.320)

But when I speak environment, it's not just the, it's not the physical, it's the people.

Guest (1:31:58.580)

But you know, when the gym is a little bit beat up, it also tells a story.

Guest (1:32:03.680)

Like there's a history to it.

Guest (1:32:06.560)

You could tell that not only is there work to be done, that work has been done here.

Guest (1:32:11.640)

Yes.

Guest (1:32:12.640)

Like battles have been fought.

Guest (1:32:13.640)

There's something to that where you're just in a long line of people, you know, that fought

Guest (1:32:20.680)

and won.

Guest (1:32:21.680)

And we could get into a whole nother space, there'd be a whole nother topic, but that

Guest (1:32:26.360)

existing energy of a space.

Guest (1:32:28.240)

I mean, we mentioned offline, Joe Rogan, he talks about the same with comedy clubs.

Guest (1:32:32.520)

There's certain, there's certain clubs that just have a history.

Guest (1:32:36.040)

There's an energy there.

Guest (1:32:38.040)

You can get all woo woo, but you know, it's there.

Guest (1:32:40.960)

It's a real thing.

Guest (1:32:41.960)

I think you walk in and you can feel it.

Guest (1:32:43.960)

You feel it.

Guest (1:32:44.960)

You feel it.

Guest (1:32:45.960)

Yeah.

Guest (1:32:46.960)

That makes me feel that somehow all of us humans are connected in a ways that's hard

Guest (1:32:52.360)

to describe, even the ones who are no longer here.

Guest (1:32:57.040)

Just the greatness that once was is still in the walls, in the space, present there.

Guest (1:33:05.040)

And we somehow can plug into that energy.

Guest (1:33:07.280)

Yeah.

Guest (1:33:08.280)

It's, we can go down a, go down a path there.

Guest (1:33:11.640)

There's something really powerful there.

Guest (1:33:13.760)

You've also mentioned a bunch of cool equipment that you've developed as part of Kabuki Strength.

Guest (1:33:20.840)

Probably a little bit of that has to do with your engineering education, but also just

Guest (1:33:24.640)

generally with the spirit of the innovator that you are.

Guest (1:33:29.160)

What are some cool, maybe revolutionary pieces of equipment that you're particularly proud

Guest (1:33:35.040)

of or just you've been obsessed with recently that you're developing?

Guest (1:33:39.600)

Yeah.

Guest (1:33:40.600)

Love to talk about that.

Guest (1:33:41.600)

So we've got some wild crazy stuff that just came out and is coming out too.

Guest (1:33:46.440)

So everything that we create and release at Kabuki Strength, the industry hasn't seen

Guest (1:33:52.640)

before.

Guest (1:33:54.440)

There's stuff that's basic foundational.

Guest (1:33:56.400)

It's been around forever because it works, but there's always more.

Guest (1:34:02.920)

It could be better.

Guest (1:34:04.400)

And why are we not looking at these things, these foundational things?

Guest (1:34:07.380)

So when people are coming up with novel things, they ended up being way different outside

Guest (1:34:10.760)

the perspective.

Guest (1:34:11.760)

And I'm coming up with things that are way different that are plays on what we already

Guest (1:34:17.000)

know works.

Guest (1:34:18.000)

So we talked about the transform bar, the only bar in the world.

Guest (1:34:20.000)

We can manipulate spinal mechanics.

Guest (1:34:22.180)

We can, so everything, everything for me from a design concept that we develop is all about

Guest (1:34:27.920)

creating products that can rapidly accommodate to the variability of an individual's leverages,

Guest (1:34:37.640)

mobility and training needs.

Guest (1:34:40.480)

Okay.

Guest (1:34:41.480)

And that's going to also create and distill down the size and scope of space that we need,

Guest (1:34:45.160)

which is going to be, continue to be an ongoing thing.

Guest (1:34:48.580)

Check out my Instagram after this and you'll see, I put an entire gym on the bed of my

Guest (1:34:51.720)

truck and went on vacation last week, drove to the desert and by entire gym, I mean a

Guest (1:34:58.880)

squat rack, full compliment of our specialty bars, a horizontal and vertical pulley system,

Guest (1:35:03.840)

handheld weights, shoulder rock, like a complete, an entire gym in product that took up the

Guest (1:35:09.360)

space the size of this bed right here.

Guest (1:35:13.160)

That's incredible.

Guest (1:35:14.160)

Because of the design scope of what we have.

Guest (1:35:16.040)

So the cool thing is that there's two other bars that fit our biomechanically sound barbell

Guest (1:35:21.280)

designs.

Guest (1:35:22.280)

We talked about the transformer bar.

Guest (1:35:23.420)

The other two are built on this thing I called playground physics.

Guest (1:35:27.920)

So we have these bars with handles that are off parallel with the axis.

Guest (1:35:35.600)

So they've been around the market for a long time.

Guest (1:35:37.440)

One is a hex bar or a trap bar.

Guest (1:35:40.560)

Another one is a, it's a pressing bar with the handles turned as well.

Guest (1:35:46.640)

And both of them suck.

Guest (1:35:48.640)

They're horrible.

Guest (1:35:49.640)

Any lifter knows if you pick it up, it's going to break your wrist and crush into your face.

Guest (1:35:54.440)

And it just, it just doesn't feel good pressing, but it alleviates the strain on the wrist.

Guest (1:36:00.280)

So people use it for that reason.

Guest (1:36:02.000)

And the, the, the trap bar, same thing.

Guest (1:36:04.760)

It's always diving forward in your hand.

Guest (1:36:06.640)

So it's kind of limited.

Guest (1:36:07.920)

It's also limited in use because you can't, you could do a lot more with it.

Guest (1:36:12.200)

So these bars are really cool playground physics.

Guest (1:36:15.000)

So as soon as the center of rotation is on the same axis as the center of mass and the

Guest (1:36:25.640)

handle is off center, you have, you have a teeter totter.

Guest (1:36:30.800)

So a teeter totter has a balance point, but it's infinitely perfect.

Guest (1:36:34.660)

So technically you can never find it.

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So always going to be sitting on one side or the other in a playground.

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And that's what these bars are designed.

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So you've got instability right here.

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You can't find the center of the bars.

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It's always trying to tip in your hands on the trap bar.

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So you can't do carries with it cause you're doing for momentum and it wants to, it wants

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to dip on you.

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Right.

Guest (1:36:50.760)

Um, the Swiss bar wants to crush your face.

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Well, what do we do?

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We just make a swing, but center of mass below center of rotation.

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And what does it do?

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Oh, it always finds center.

Guest (1:37:02.700)

So, so the handles on the, our pressing bar it's art.

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So the handles are above center of rotation and then, and then every angle, instead of

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just being a certain fixed angles, each angle is based on the width, the average width of

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an individual.

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So the internal and external rotational bias is based of the shoulder is based on the width,

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leaving just a little bit left because we talked about the lap being a stabilizer.

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You still need to have a little bit of cue of external rotation to engage that as a stabilizer.

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Boom.

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Now all of a sudden you have a bar and I kid you not, this is a great story.

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Major league baseball.

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When I presented it, every head strength coach for a major league baseball team, maybe not

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every, but damn near most of them have bad shoulders.

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They can't press.

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They've gotten shoulder surgeries, so on.

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And so we're showing them, they love all our stuff and I'm like, Hey, I've got this cool

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prototype I want to show you.

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It's a pressing bar.

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And they're like, Oh, you know, major league baseball is a little hesitant on pressing

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because the dangers for the shoulder and I can't, I haven't been able to take a bar to

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my chest.

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I mean, I'd really love to.

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It's been five years since I've, I've been able to to XX train and I'm like, just try

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it.

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Put a bar on my chest without pain.

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I'm like, just try it.

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Put it in there.

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Ooh, that feels good.

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Now the arc makes it actually three inches deeper.

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So people are automatically scared.

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I can't do that.

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Cause that's an extra range of motion.

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Right?

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Like, Ooh, put a plate on there.

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They're doing it.

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By the time the staff's like, they're all standing around, you see like, what's going

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on?

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Put two plates on.

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You see the, just like he gets up.

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How do you feel like, I feel fine.

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No pain at all.

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I did this with five teams with five of the, it happening repeatedly five times that they

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and every one of them worked up to two plates and did reps varied with zero pain to a three

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inch range or greater range of major.

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Cause what did we do?

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We stacked all the joints and we provided stability at the end that we balanced internal

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and external rotation.

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I mean just basic playground physics and it changed the game.

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Now we get a greater range of motion with a greater training effect with the negative

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stresses removed.

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Our trap bar opened up one side, which there was already some like that out there created.

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It pops up so you can pick up, take the weights on and off.

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It's got a built in Jack and then created the high handle position, which already did.

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Everybody uses the high handle on a trap bar.

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They just don't know why they like it.

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The handle that's on center, we offset just a little bit, not enough to make a difference

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on the range of motion lift or even notice visibly, but it still has the same effect.

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So both handles now have that.

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We added the option of different handle sizes based on whatever your needs are.

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One that rolls to develop a grip and then different widths that you could choose from

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based on whether you're training a teen athlete or a seven foot six NBA player or a NFL lineman

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so that we can accommodate for all these differences.

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Now it becomes the most functional all around bar around because now you can do carries

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with it.

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You can do split squats with it.

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You could do curls with it because it goes around the body.

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You can do overhead presses because you don't have a thing that gets in your way and you

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can flip it up into position.

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You can do bent over rows and not run into your shins.

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You can do seal rows off of a bench.

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You can do ab rollouts.

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You could, should I go on?

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Yeah.

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So you can use it as like the main bar.

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The best multi purpose bar around.

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You got a home gym, one bar.

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Like how do you develop totally new equipment like this?

Guest (1:40:16.420)

I scratch it on paper.

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Maybe weld some cut up and weld up a prototype, but usually I just hand the scratched up paper

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to my engineering manager and that's what he says his job is to distill my chicken scratch

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into something real and then that team picks it up.

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But in the old days, starting out, I just walk out, I just walk out and do it.

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You talk about engineering.

Guest (1:40:40.200)

I'm actually more, I work more of an artist fashion.

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It's in my head and I just go create with no plans.

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And so they have to pick that up and actually do the engineering and testing and all that.

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And then we got two other products came out this year.

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Freaking wild.

Guest (1:40:53.200)

Are you familiar with training with a flywheel?

Guest (1:40:55.240)

No, no, it's a flywheel.

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A flywheel is a spinning object that creates an inertial mass and then it reverses direction.

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So whatever you put into it and there's ones out there.

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But ours is the first patent pending.

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That's all everything all in one unit.

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So it's a floor based as well as a horizontal.

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So you can basically do any pulley movement in the world.

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And now everything that you put into it on a concentric force, it whips right back as

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a peak centric load.

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So there's an accelerating whipping motion.

Guest (1:41:26.760)

It just yeah, basically, yeah, I mean, okay, I have to have trouble imagining exactly many

Guest (1:41:32.920)

of the things you're describing, I suppose, have to be experienced, right?

Guest (1:41:37.200)

Yes.

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Because there's a magic and there's a lot of research.

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They've been around.

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They're adopted more heavily in Europe, quite heavily in Europe, but not as much in the

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US because they sell them as a be all end all tool, which they're not.

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They're crazy for what they do, but it's not the it's another tool.

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And so we have a very high quality unit now that is half the cost of everybody else's

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because the innovation of a movable mount point that you for them, you have to have

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two pieces of equipment.

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We have one.

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So and then a few other things, better platform to be able to do things and that we can do

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what we call off platform work, which allows us to do movements like punches and standups,

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things like that.

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And then I've got a handheld weight coming out next month that we can actually play with.

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So varying the load with it, never leaving your hand by changing the leverage point.

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And so what do we think?

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What exercise are we talking about here?

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Anything that would be a dumbbell or a kettlebell movement.

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So it functions, it does the function of a kettlebell, a dumbbell and what we call a

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center mass bell, as well as provides variable loading within a range.

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So how can you change like how can you change the load?

Guest (1:42:47.240)

Because load.

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Well, we don't actually change the load.

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We change the torque on the on the joint that we're working, which is the same.

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That's actually what is creating the force.

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Right.

Guest (1:42:56.240)

So if I'm doing a front raise, it's where this this downward force is times the distance

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away.

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Right.

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Which also then makes it no force when I've got at the bottom of the front raise, which

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is why it's so easy with this.

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It's like a kettlebell.

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It's offset, except it has three different handles.

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But it's offset just that a kettlebell, you can't do it because the offset so far it becomes

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a wrist movement.

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So ours has three different sizes and the offset just enough so that you can pick.

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If I put it in a front raise position or curl position, I could put it in outward position

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and the force is almost what it is at the at the top.

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Then I get the top and it's the same exact or the curl.

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So I can actually change the force curve in the movement and then I can just release the

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pressure a little bit and let it swing into position and keep doing a drop set with never

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letting it down.

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Yeah.

Guest (1:43:41.560)

Yeah.

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So it's got a really nice texture grip that allows you to hold it in different positions.

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And then the load offset is just enough that it doesn't overpower the wrist.

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And then you've got different hand sizes so that you can maximize this relationship and

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hit whatever joint that you're applying.

Guest (1:43:54.460)

So sounds incredible.

Guest (1:43:55.900)

It's really freaking well, it's awesome because you can because the variable load.

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Now I could go straight from front raises to side raises or rear or curl because without

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like because I don't have to put it down.

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So now my time under tension goes through the roof.

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And by the way, the same effect with a flywheel trainer because the variable whatever you

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put into it is what it kicks back.

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So you have a constant time under tension because there's no rest points either.

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So all this stuff is working on maximizing time under tension, which anyway, it's cool

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stuff.

Guest (1:44:25.040)

Anyway, I get excited.

Guest (1:44:26.040)

Well, let me ask you about another thing you've already mentioned, but I find this really

Guest (1:44:31.320)

interesting, which is barefoot running and you're sort of a company, Barefoot Athletics.

Guest (1:44:40.000)

Yeah.

Guest (1:44:41.000)

And the tagline is optimizing the human to ground interface.

Guest (1:44:46.000)

We've talked about this a little bit with the power lifting.

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How do you think about the the foot ground interface?

Guest (1:44:57.880)

It's interesting that we know that we should train all these parts of our body to be able

Guest (1:45:05.680)

to be stronger, be more resilient.

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But we think that the foot is different, that we need to package it and modify it.

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And somehow that that's the science of making it healthy where I challenge people think

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about that.

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Like first thing you do in the morning is roll out of bed and put your weightlifting

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belt on and wrap it on tight and wear it till you go to bed at night.

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Do it with your shoulders, your knees, wake up and put some knee wraps on an elbow wraps

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and see what happens.

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Then you'll get weaker, you'll lose movement capacity and you'll start affecting other

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areas of the body very negatively because they will start picking up the compensation

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for those joints that are not moving properly.

Guest (1:45:50.920)

This is it.

Guest (1:45:51.920)

What shoes are for is to protect you from the environment, from cuts and abrasions and

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heat and things like that.

Guest (1:45:59.800)

But the foot, let me the mind blowing is like every other area of the body.

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You need to use it and you need to strengthen it and you need to learn to control it.

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That's it.

Guest (1:46:13.440)

That's all I have to say about the subject.

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It's that simple.

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But somehow we have been sold entire industries like the orthotics industry.

Guest (1:46:23.880)

It's completely false.

Guest (1:46:25.280)

Meta analysis of the data shows that orthotics do nothing beyond temporary relief from pain

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over a six, eight week period of time and provide no long term benefit.

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And I can't tell you how many people I've eliminated back or knee or hip pain from getting

Guest (1:46:38.720)

from working on strengthening and controlling the foot and ankle complex.

Guest (1:46:42.740)

We believe we've villainized and said a low arch is a condition that needs fixed.

Guest (1:46:50.480)

Like when it really is just controlling the foot and ankle complex and how they relate

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to each other and how we use that.

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Is it like go put on boxing gloves in the morning and do that for the next 20 years

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and see what happens.

Guest (1:47:02.520)

It's not about finding the right shoe that fits because your foot has been deformed.

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And so I'm not like some wacky go like, oh, you got to be barefoot forever.

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Do this like, no, I'm just saying go spend some time using it, strengthen it, learn to

Guest (1:47:16.840)

control it and you will work better in a shoe.

Guest (1:47:19.320)

But the whole running shoe movement with the raised heel, that was the person that that

Guest (1:47:24.620)

suggested that that in to Nike way back when they were trying to figure out what to do,

Guest (1:47:29.580)

the reason, and he says it's, it's the worst thing that he ever did.

Guest (1:47:35.760)

Because we were coming from an era of people wearing heeled shoes, which by the way came

Guest (1:47:40.080)

from stirrups way back in the day.

Guest (1:47:42.780)

That's where the whole heel came from is to go into stirrup, but then it went into fashion.

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And then the running craze started coming around in the seventies.

Guest (1:47:49.440)

They're they're starting to push this, the general mass population.

Guest (1:47:52.200)

And they realized that they were causing injuries and like, what are we going to do?

Guest (1:47:55.640)

Well, that's because everybody was in this position and had a shortened, a shortened

Guest (1:48:00.000)

calf muscle.

Guest (1:48:01.000)

And it's like, well, the work around, let's just put a heel on it so we don't injure them.

Guest (1:48:06.160)

That's it.

Guest (1:48:07.160)

And now because the raised heel, you got to raise the toe.

Guest (1:48:09.840)

And then now with that, if you go stand on something and pull your inner toe in and in

Guest (1:48:15.040)

a squat position, just reach down and do it.

Guest (1:48:17.160)

You'll see that you have no control over internal or next door and rotation of your, of, of

Guest (1:48:21.560)

your leg.

Guest (1:48:22.560)

You don't and, or your foot and you actually have to put a support in for the arch to be

Guest (1:48:28.760)

able to passively control those structures.

Guest (1:48:33.120)

It's just bandaid on top of bandaid on top of bandaid.

Guest (1:48:36.480)

Use it, strengthen it.

Guest (1:48:37.600)

If you want to wear some shoes cause they look good or fancy, I'm like, I have no problem.

Guest (1:48:40.680)

I mean, I go out on a wife.

Guest (1:48:42.000)

My wife will put on some high heels every now and again.

Guest (1:48:45.480)

But all I'm saying is use your foot.

Guest (1:48:48.160)

My thousand pound squat, my thousand pound deadlift, we're done barefoot.

Guest (1:48:51.500)

I'm not trying to sell you shoes.

Guest (1:48:53.880)

Go do it with no shoe.

Guest (1:48:56.320)

That's what I've been promoting.

Guest (1:48:57.320)

I did that for six years and I promoted it, but people ask me like, well, what do I do?

Guest (1:49:02.360)

Because my gym requires shoes.

Guest (1:49:03.880)

Okay.

Guest (1:49:04.880)

What do I go?

Guest (1:49:06.680)

And uh, and then I go, well, you know, you could pick up these other finger shoes or

Guest (1:49:11.080)

whatever and they go, man, my wife won't have sex with me if I do that.

Guest (1:49:15.300)

And I go, I know mine either.

Guest (1:49:17.560)

Like trust me, I'm not making this up.

Guest (1:49:20.140)

Basically in that market markets to one segment and they're still missing some gaps because

Guest (1:49:23.960)

they, they still have a little bit too narrow of a toe box.

Guest (1:49:26.840)

And if you're lifting, you have the opportunity to really get that splay and start working

Guest (1:49:29.920)

on this stuff better.

Guest (1:49:31.280)

So, um, I just wanted to create a shoe.

Guest (1:49:33.980)

These ones are odd colored cause it's a partnership with Kabuki.

Guest (1:49:36.400)

Normally we've got a black or a gray, uh, low top, high top sticks to the ground for

Guest (1:49:40.980)

lifting so we can do that and very pliable.

Guest (1:49:43.640)

It's a moccasin.

Guest (1:49:45.200)

It's a modern day moccasin, but looks okay that you can wear it around in other areas.

Guest (1:49:49.200)

If you, if you so choose, like, you know what the number one healthcare costs in America

Guest (1:49:53.580)

is.

Guest (1:49:54.580)

What's that diabetes, uh, heart disease, cancer, low back pain.

Guest (1:50:05.040)

Hmm.

Guest (1:50:06.040)

Now, what do you attribute a little back pain to?

Guest (1:50:09.320)

Well, it's attributed to a lot of things, um, but inability to control spinal position,

Guest (1:50:13.600)

um, which starts happening from, uh, some breathing issues.

Guest (1:50:17.280)

Uh, it also happens from the foot.

Guest (1:50:19.720)

Um, so there's a lot of stuff, but everything that I do actually focus on improving this.

Guest (1:50:24.280)

Uh, that, and it all starts with this is one thing, like this doesn't affect breathing,

Guest (1:50:29.240)

but, um, so it does actually affect breathing to some extent and spinal stabilization.

Guest (1:50:32.960)

So the raised heel and toe will make you stride further, um, because of just how it operates,

Guest (1:50:39.000)

but that overstride is a result of opening this.

Guest (1:50:43.000)

So we opened the pelvis and diaphragm.

Guest (1:50:44.640)

Did we talk about that and the impact that that has for controlling and spine?

Guest (1:50:47.320)

Yeah.

Guest (1:50:48.320)

I think we touched on that.

Guest (1:50:49.320)

Um, but it, it's all this stuff plays together.

Guest (1:50:52.400)

So the gait affects that.

Guest (1:50:53.760)

And so the shoe affects the gait and then, so it's all connected.

Guest (1:50:57.000)

All connected.

Guest (1:50:58.000)

Let me be very purposeful with some conversation here though.

Guest (1:51:01.840)

We've talked about periodization.

Guest (1:51:03.840)

This was a big gap.

Guest (1:51:04.840)

So, um, people go, yeah, well when people started running with those, they started having

Guest (1:51:08.520)

injuries back when, uh, the finger, uh, company produced those and didn't do the education

Guest (1:51:13.100)

around this very simple concept.

Guest (1:51:14.920)

You do not walk into the gym if you haven't squatted and start squatting 225 from, from

Guest (1:51:18.640)

max recs every week, day or every day over day.

Guest (1:51:22.400)

And that's what people did because they didn't weren't told that you need to build the capacity

Guest (1:51:27.320)

to do this.

Guest (1:51:29.240)

You go wear these and walk around in your office or wherever all day long, your feet

Guest (1:51:33.100)

are going to hurt.

Guest (1:51:34.100)

They're going to be sore.

Guest (1:51:36.980)

Do it for 10% of your time.

Guest (1:51:40.520)

Do that for a month, then add some.

Guest (1:51:42.920)

That will build the capacity to do this.

Guest (1:51:45.160)

And then that's going to start having the ability to strengthen, manage the foot.

Guest (1:51:48.200)

And there's a whole lot of other stuff.

Guest (1:51:49.320)

I've got videos on things that you can do by whatever you want or just, just spend some

Guest (1:51:54.360)

time out of them.

Guest (1:51:55.680)

Like, that's all that I want people to do because it is so simple and it has such a

Guest (1:52:00.240)

profound impact.

Guest (1:52:01.240)

Yeah, it does.

Guest (1:52:02.240)

I, what I did, uh, I noticed when you walked out, when I walked in, I was like, Oh, Hey,

Guest (1:52:06.720)

you're spending some time without the last shoes on.

Guest (1:52:10.120)

Uh, well, what I did, um, I think it's already now two years ago and I was doing a lot of

Guest (1:52:15.440)

running.

Guest (1:52:16.440)

I do like a 10 mile run.

Guest (1:52:17.960)

I would take my shoes off for the last like half mile and I run like that.

Guest (1:52:22.300)

And that was for me really helpful to ensure that I have proper form.

Guest (1:52:27.240)

Form that minimizes pain on the way I run.

Guest (1:52:29.680)

I still like shoes.

Guest (1:52:31.080)

I benefit a lot from shoes, the protection they provide, but it's for running we're referring

Guest (1:52:36.400)

to, uh, especially trail running and so on.

Guest (1:52:40.640)

And in the city when there's glass and all those kinds of things, uh, but it's really

Guest (1:52:44.200)

important to have minimal sort of protection on your feet.

Guest (1:52:47.000)

For me, at least it was to figure out the ways that my form basic movement and like

Guest (1:52:54.120)

the positioning in the foot, the impact of the foot and everything, you know, the, the,

Guest (1:52:59.680)

the lower leg, the entirety of the torso, really how it's improperly positioned in

Guest (1:53:06.360)

terms for the objective of minimizing pain and the barefoot running really helped fix

Guest (1:53:12.280)

that for me.

Guest (1:53:13.280)

Cause I figured out that I need to take shorter steps, more frequent, you know, all those

Guest (1:53:19.700)

kinds of things.

Guest (1:53:20.700)

And that really helps you figure that out.

Guest (1:53:22.280)

Like let's be realist about stuff, like, um, spend some time using it, strengthen it.

Guest (1:53:29.160)

And I've got some great ways to do that and learn how to do that.

Guest (1:53:32.520)

So yeah.

Guest (1:53:33.760)

What is a good diet for strength development?

Guest (1:53:36.120)

I've just to give you some context, I've been eating mostly meat, not for strength, mostly

Guest (1:53:41.440)

for mental performance.

Guest (1:53:42.640)

I just enjoy it.

Guest (1:53:44.040)

Yes.

Guest (1:53:45.040)

You need to have a base level of protein building blocks for tissue, right?

Guest (1:53:50.160)

We need to have enough fats to be able to have hormones work and key processes in the

Guest (1:53:55.600)

body.

Guest (1:53:56.600)

We need to have, well, you don't need to have from a performance aspect carbohydrates necessarily

Guest (1:54:00.960)

because the other ones can convert into injury sources, but for a performance athlete, carbohydrates

Guest (1:54:06.080)

can be very beneficial, uh, as well.

Guest (1:54:09.440)

So, um, so I look at it as you want, you need a base level fats, you need a base level of

Guest (1:54:15.480)

proteins and then you adjust the carbohydrate intake based on the needs.

Guest (1:54:19.720)

I'm not anti carbohydrate by any means, um, cause a lot of people will, they look at me

Guest (1:54:25.200)

now when they see like how lean I am and they, they jump to a conclusion, you must be keto.

Guest (1:54:29.180)

You must be carnivore.

Guest (1:54:30.180)

You must be whatever.

Guest (1:54:31.180)

Like, so losing and gaining weight is simply eating less or eating more.

Guest (1:54:37.640)

I mean it, ah, and it, we get so complicated.

Guest (1:54:41.640)

Oh, that my fat, they're like, what's your fasting window?

Guest (1:54:44.900)

If I'm, if I'm doing fasting, it's just because it works with my, my environment.

Guest (1:54:50.600)

Sometimes I do it.

Guest (1:54:51.600)

Sometimes I don't.

Guest (1:54:52.900)

All that does is control how much calories that you take big success with keto and carnivore

Guest (1:54:57.960)

diets.

Guest (1:54:58.960)

A lot, uh, and, and put on weight with those, with those diets, um, you know, protein actually

Guest (1:55:05.400)

has a thermogenic effect.

Guest (1:55:07.080)

And so you have to have a massive amount of fats if you have a only meat diet because

Guest (1:55:11.880)

you can literally starve to death.

Guest (1:55:13.940)

There's a, there's a show where they put people out in the wilderness and this guy, the one

Guest (1:55:18.560)

that won, one of the ones I looked on, they threw him way like up in the, uh, uh, past

Guest (1:55:22.760)

a lot, you know, out the way out there, there was nothing, but he somehow got a caribou

Guest (1:55:26.280)

and killed it.

Guest (1:55:27.320)

And he still lost a pound a day for 30 days with the caribou because his fat was stolen

Guest (1:55:32.080)

by a, uh, uh, and, and he could eat all the meat he wanted and then he almost got pulled

Guest (1:55:37.380)

because his weight loss.

Guest (1:55:38.960)

Right.

Guest (1:55:39.960)

Um, but that isn't actually a performance.

Guest (1:55:42.400)

So those types of keto and carnivore are not performance diets.

Guest (1:55:45.480)

So they're not going to be as effective at supplying, uh, the energy needs for high capacity

Guest (1:55:53.120)

training.

Guest (1:55:54.120)

So don't get me wrong.

Guest (1:55:55.120)

I mean, you can be a successful, like elite athlete with a, with a vegan diet, but it's

Guest (1:56:01.960)

not as easy to do it with other diets.

Guest (1:56:05.400)

So on you're missing some base nutrients, so many nutrients and meat, I believe, uh,

Guest (1:56:11.600)

having greens in your diet is really beneficial.

Guest (1:56:14.680)

Lots of research, but there's people in the other worlds that argue that they don't need

Guest (1:56:18.040)

them, but they help clear organs, provide micronutrients, all this sort of stuff.

Guest (1:56:22.400)

So I eat simply a whole well rounded diet.

Guest (1:56:25.800)

And I've gone from, I can go from 285 pounds squat and a ton of weight to eating less and

Guest (1:56:32.640)

dropping all the way down to, you know, seven, 8% body fat with veins standing out everywhere

Guest (1:56:37.240)

without a tissue on me, just with amazing, great tasting food to lose weight or be healthy

Guest (1:56:43.960)

does not mean that you need to eat flavorless bland food.

Guest (1:56:48.980)

So that's the main thing I try to get across.

Guest (1:56:51.560)

Yes.

Guest (1:56:52.560)

Eat less to lose weight.

Guest (1:56:53.560)

Eat more to gain weight.

Guest (1:56:54.720)

Yep.

Guest (1:56:55.720)

Make sure that you've got enough protein.

Guest (1:56:56.720)

Make sure that you've got your micronutrients covered, which is going to cover by eating

Guest (1:56:59.780)

real food.

Guest (1:57:01.320)

Don't go low fat, no fat.

Guest (1:57:03.380)

If you want a performance, don't go no carb, but if it works, any of those things.

Guest (1:57:07.780)

So diet approach, when you look at diets, understand that they're how aggressive they

Guest (1:57:13.920)

are.

Guest (1:57:14.920)

So like keto can make you lose a lot of weight.

Guest (1:57:16.400)

Carnivore can make you lose a lot of weight.

Guest (1:57:17.760)

A lot of that upfront is actually dropping glycogen stores.

Guest (1:57:21.840)

So you're actually just reducing water in your muscle and fat tissue.

Guest (1:57:25.720)

So which is why it doesn't, isn't as great for a performance diet.

Guest (1:57:29.320)

But understand that every diet also has a level of discipline and does it fit your lifestyle?

Guest (1:57:37.080)

So I suggest people don't find a diet.

Guest (1:57:40.020)

You need to find a lifestyle because that's what sustainable, I hate the word diet to

Guest (1:57:44.160)

begin with.

Guest (1:57:46.280)

But behaviors are sustainable and then do that and then over time the things you'll

Guest (1:57:52.920)

get to where you need to get.

Guest (1:57:55.640)

Diet itself, just by the name of it is not sustainable because it is a short term thing

Guest (1:58:02.280)

to get somewhere.

Guest (1:58:03.840)

Yeah, I tend to try to measure it because I definitely have a love heat relationship

Guest (1:58:08.960)

with food.

Guest (1:58:09.960)

I tend to look back and say like by following this particular protocol, lifestyle, whatever,

Guest (1:58:18.080)

what was the level of happiness?

Guest (1:58:19.720)

Yes.

Guest (1:58:20.720)

So not like weight loss or weight gain or all those kinds of things.

Guest (1:58:25.560)

It's the entirety of the picture, productivity, just feeling good throughout the day, socially

Guest (1:58:30.400)

also, like interacting with people.

Guest (1:58:32.800)

Because so much of a human connection, like I mentioned before, is over food.

Guest (1:58:37.840)

And if you're going to limit yourself in that regard, you're limiting a certain fundamental

Guest (1:58:41.600)

aspect of life.

Guest (1:58:43.040)

A number of years ago, I did like 20 to 22 hour fasts every day.

Guest (1:58:49.920)

And I'm like, well, this doesn't work.

Guest (1:58:51.140)

I can't do business lunches and stuff like that.

Guest (1:58:53.280)

So when I was in my fasting thing, I went to a 16 so I could have a light lunch just

Guest (1:58:57.020)

for the social aspect of it and perform that.

Guest (1:59:01.800)

And then that's why the typical bodybuilding, like the eight meal a day diet has never worked

Guest (1:59:07.560)

for me because I've always been a very bit like trying to fit that between meetings and

Guest (1:59:11.360)

other stuff.

Guest (1:59:12.900)

What that diet provides is it just you get less bloat in distention of a larger meal.

Guest (1:59:18.240)

But at the end of the day, you get the same exact results.

Guest (1:59:20.760)

Pick a lifestyle, live that you can have really great tasting food.

Guest (1:59:26.160)

And that to me is the same thing.

Guest (1:59:28.400)

And this is why I'm like really hitting this point, because also with the dieting and like

Guest (1:59:32.640)

the approach like, oh, I'm going to do this and people pick these chicken and broccoli

Guest (1:59:37.800)

recipes and guess what?

Guest (1:59:39.480)

You're going to break.

Guest (1:59:40.780)

If you do not, if you do not enjoy it, you will break.

Guest (1:59:46.920)

So it is a very important point.

Guest (1:59:50.480)

Well, I also slightly push back or maybe to elaborate, if you don't enjoy moderation,

Guest (1:59:59.480)

for me particularly, I have trouble moderating certain things, most foods, I would say.

Guest (20:00.160)

going to affect shoulder extension, flexion, all these sorts of things.

Guest (20:03.080)

So it could even affect things down of what's looking at dorsiflexion issues on the foot.

Guest (20:08.280)

And then that's why I go to the foot next, because it has the second largest global impact.

Guest (20:12.920)

And then from there, now I'm going to look at the big energy drivers, which is the hip

Guest (20:15.960)

complex, shoulder complex.

Guest (20:18.000)

And then we can start looking at kind of the peripheral things.

Guest (20:21.120)

But usually that's some sort of output of the other.

Guest (20:23.080)

But the knees, the elbows, the things like that.

Guest (20:26.400)

So it's all about getting the stack, which affects neurology.

Guest (20:30.620)

So let's talk in engineering terms.

Guest (20:33.420)

You get in a car, modern car today, and a lot of them will have this traction control

Guest (20:36.840)

button in there.

Guest (20:37.840)

And there's a big misconception that, you know, I'm out and it's it's snowy or here

Guest (20:42.540)

in Austin, only rainy.

Guest (20:43.540)

Well, it probably doesn't rain much, but you're going around a corner, start slipping.

Guest (20:46.880)

It's like, oh, it's going to send the powers from the wheels that are slipping to the ones

Guest (20:49.360)

that are gripping and keep me from crashing and dying a fiery death.

Guest (20:53.640)

Well, that's not how it works.

Guest (20:55.680)

It's the exact same.

Guest (20:56.960)

We've got we've got the we've got the tires, which are our foot, you know, the connection

Guest (21:01.480)

to the ground.

Guest (21:02.480)

Right.

Guest (21:03.480)

We've got the power driver, which is, you know, the the engine, the transmission delivering,

Guest (21:08.880)

you know, the power through it.

Guest (21:10.560)

And we've got the stability or suspension.

Guest (21:13.200)

And then we have the neurology.

Guest (21:16.480)

And what the neurology is doing, it's sensing that we don't have good stability or loss

Guest (21:22.840)

of connection somewhere.

Guest (21:24.640)

And so I need to save you from crashing and hurting yourself.

Guest (21:27.940)

And so it goes to the engine and says, let's retard the timing.

Guest (21:31.560)

Let's reduce the shift patterns.

Guest (21:32.980)

And we're just reducing the power output.

Guest (21:35.720)

And that's straight how the human body works.

Guest (21:38.160)

So when I do this stuff, it's actually affecting that.

Guest (21:41.600)

I mean, I can take somebody and do some minute changes with the neck position at the thoracic

Guest (21:45.880)

outlet.

Guest (21:46.880)

OK, and immediately see an enhancement in power output.

Guest (21:51.280)

And I can measure it.

Guest (21:52.280)

We measure this stuff with velocity devices and see like a 10 percent jump.

Guest (21:58.100)

And so think about that.

Guest (21:59.840)

What about all your training through the years where you actually had additional capacity?

Guest (22:05.780)

But you weren't using it because your traction control was on.

Guest (22:09.820)

Now you figure this out stuff and now you start stacking it.

Guest (22:12.120)

Now you can see so much greater.

Guest (22:14.260)

So it's not just injury prevention.

Guest (22:17.780)

This is performance and additive performance over time.

Guest (22:22.780)

This is huge.

Guest (22:23.780)

And people don't really think about this stuff.

Guest (22:26.280)

But we can turn that stuff off, which is actually going to also, again, make us make us safer.

Guest (22:31.360)

But what we want to do is the performance tuned race car.

Guest (22:33.520)

Do they have a traction control button?

Guest (22:35.880)

No, they got some amazing tires to grip the ground, a performance tuned suspension, and

Guest (22:41.440)

that driver is going to put what his foot to the metal.

Guest (22:43.920)

He's going to put it to the floor.

Guest (22:46.200)

OK, that's a performance vehicle.

Guest (22:49.000)

That's what we want to be.

Guest (22:50.000)

I want to continue on that line.

Guest (22:52.280)

But first I have to ask, like, how did it feel to accomplish the grand goal?

Guest (22:56.120)

Oh, my God.

Guest (22:57.120)

OK, when you just stand back.

Guest (22:59.440)

Oh, my thousand pounds for reps.

Guest (23:02.400)

What it feel like?

Guest (23:04.200)

Anybody can go watch the video online.

Guest (23:06.400)

It's well filmed, by the way.

Guest (23:09.840)

Got me all like excited.

Guest (23:11.320)

Oh, well, the movies.

Guest (23:13.280)

So we actually have the final footage of that, the good footage not posted yet.

Guest (23:17.340)

So it's literally just an Instagram video or a phone video right now.

Guest (23:20.760)

The only one online.

Guest (23:21.760)

Yeah.

Guest (23:22.760)

It's on your YouTube channel.

Guest (23:23.760)

It's dramatic.

Guest (23:24.760)

Yes, it is.

Guest (23:25.760)

Yeah.

Guest (23:26.760)

Came out just time to the music perfectly, too, which is I listened to some odd music,

Guest (23:30.280)

which there's some reason behind that.

Guest (23:31.880)

OK, but I liked it, though.

Guest (23:34.320)

It was great.

Guest (23:35.320)

You're saying there's full length footage.

Guest (23:37.880)

There's a documentary that's it's got a little slowed because of covid, because it's also

Guest (23:41.920)

a backstory of the eagle and the dragon.

Guest (23:44.400)

My book about why I do kind of the things that I've done in my life or that's what I'm

Guest (23:49.880)

assuming the director is working on.

Guest (23:51.080)

I don't really have the control of the movie, right?

Guest (23:54.800)

But but OK, but the video's OK.

Guest (23:58.560)

How did it feel?

Guest (23:59.560)

How did it feel?

Guest (24:00.560)

I started crying.

Guest (24:01.600)

It was overwhelming to have worked so intensely and so long and hard at something that pushed

Guest (24:10.400)

every ounce of me to the limit that and and I did it.

Guest (24:15.200)

I'm sorry.

Guest (24:16.200)

I'm getting a little emotional.

Guest (24:17.200)

I did exactly what I said I was going to fucking do like and it was it was overpowering.

Guest (24:23.920)

I mean, I was just crying uncontrollably just with a mixture of I.

Guest (24:31.720)

I don't know what the mixture of emotions is hard to explain because it was the completion

Guest (24:39.840)

of something.

Guest (24:40.840)

It was a new phase of my life.

Guest (24:41.840)

I mean, there's so many things here.

Guest (24:45.240)

So when you set an impossible goal and you accomplished it, one, two is like on the broader

Guest (24:50.640)

humanity aspect, like how many humans in this world accomplish perfection in a particular

Guest (24:58.280)

direction required to do this?

Guest (25:01.280)

So like you're basically representing like one little like like little glimmer of excellence

Guest (25:09.240)

of the human spirit.

Guest (25:10.920)

There's always more.

Guest (25:12.360)

So understand this is a basic fundamental.

Guest (25:16.800)

You can always do better.

Guest (25:18.240)

There is no such thing as perfection.

Guest (25:20.080)

You could always there is always more.

Guest (25:23.160)

So anytime you reach something, any amazing workout or accomplishment in life, could you

Guest (25:28.000)

have put more into it?

Guest (25:29.080)

Could you?

Guest (25:30.080)

Yes.

Guest (25:31.080)

But here's the thing.

Guest (25:33.560)

I left on my terms.

Guest (25:37.040)

I said, this is it.

Guest (25:38.680)

I'm going to work towards I've been training for 30 years.

Guest (25:42.040)

I'm going to do this thing that is like I couldn't even say that I was going to do it

Guest (25:45.920)

years before.

Guest (25:48.280)

I'm going to do it and then I'm done.

Guest (25:51.560)

I didn't leave from an injury.

Guest (25:53.120)

I wasn't forced.

Guest (25:54.120)

I wasn't.

Guest (25:55.880)

I left on.

Guest (25:56.880)

I did exactly what I said.

Guest (25:58.080)

I went to a level that I.

Guest (26:02.000)

I left on my terms and that's unique because that's usually not the case.

Guest (26:07.400)

Sometimes you kind of either taper out or it doesn't matter.

Guest (26:10.120)

I'm talking like anything in life in general, right?

Guest (26:12.840)

Like you taper out, you fail, you hurt, like you lose.

Guest (26:17.560)

Like something, you know, you roll into retirement.

Guest (26:22.200)

You accomplish something truly great and you walked away on your own terms.

Guest (26:25.840)

Is there a sadness completing something like that?

Guest (26:30.440)

Because it's in one perspective, the greatest thing you'll ever do.

Guest (26:37.360)

And like when you accomplish such a great height, in some sense, you have to face your

Guest (26:42.320)

mortality at that point.

Guest (26:44.480)

So good question, but it is certainly not the greatest thing that I'll ever do.

Guest (26:49.560)

The greatest physical street I'll ever do.

Guest (26:51.880)

The greatest physical street, yes.

Guest (26:55.160)

But that was an expression of some of my values and the way that I want to live.

Guest (27:01.280)

It was a way of expressing it.

Guest (27:03.360)

So understanding that is hugely fundamental because we do see so many athletes get to

Guest (27:11.200)

the end of a career and then they fall into a depressive state and struggle with drugs,

Guest (27:17.440)

alcohol, depression, and so on because they lost how they identified themselves and trying

Guest (27:23.560)

to figure out where to turn, what to do.

Guest (27:25.320)

But a big central component of their identity is lost.

Guest (27:29.460)

So I knew that this was one way to express that and my grand goals have shifted.

Guest (27:38.640)

They're shifted to other outlets that allow me to express that.

Guest (27:41.880)

Like my companies, Kabuki Strength, I'm going to change the face of fitness as well as all

Guest (27:48.560)

the way through with its integration with clinical medicine and telemedicine.

Guest (27:52.480)

And I got another five years before even people see what I'm working on, five years in right

Guest (27:56.400)

now because I had to invent equipment, I have to develop methodologies that we're talking

Guest (28:00.280)

about.

Guest (28:01.280)

I had to do this stuff that ground layer wasn't done to create a cohesive ecosystem of training

Guest (28:06.800)

methodology tied to the tools that we're using today, to the environment, tied to the clinical

Guest (28:10.800)

practice assessment, tied to the interaction between all those and how that actually needs

Guest (28:16.380)

to be reframed because so much of this is broken.

Guest (28:21.280)

But there is sadness.

Guest (28:24.640)

I won't deny that.

Guest (28:26.560)

And the sadness comes in the singularity of focus that I had at that time, the being in

Guest (28:35.760)

the process.

Guest (28:36.760)

Not necessarily doing it, but like having being in this place that the rest of the world

Guest (28:42.280)

kind of fell away from me in those final phases to have something so intense, to have a team

Guest (28:47.400)

around me so focused on supporting and like it took me a couple of months after that squad.

Guest (28:52.840)

But I finally one day I woke up and I was like, oh, welcome back to the world.

Guest (28:59.680)

Like I was in such a mental fog.

Guest (29:02.200)

Like I was, it took me a while to climb out of that.

Guest (29:06.040)

But that space, that level of intensity and drive and living and being in that space,

Guest (29:14.140)

I do miss that.

Guest (29:15.760)

But I also, I can't continue that.

Guest (29:17.520)

I couldn't continue.

Guest (29:18.520)

Like there's a point of like, you push it so hard, the level to try to go from there

Guest (29:23.840)

is not acceptable for what you, the impacts that'll have on your life or how you want

Guest (29:27.540)

to live.

Guest (29:28.540)

And it was taking away those final, like I had to do extreme things and live in an extreme

Guest (29:32.920)

way to get there.

Guest (29:34.720)

You're just a genius in this whole space of strength and health and almost like biology

Guest (29:41.700)

that this strength feat is just one representation of that.

Guest (29:45.580)

But this particular strength, it required that kind of singular focus, which I think,

Guest (29:51.920)

I don't know, there's something beautiful about that singular focus that's often only

Guest (29:57.000)

truly perfected in athletics.

Guest (29:59.120)

I see it with the greatest Olympic athletes as well.

Guest (2:00:05.920)

So my source of happiness comes with foods, even if they're bland, the ones that can enjoy,

Guest (2:00:12.540)

but enjoy moderation.

Guest (2:00:13.540)

So there's, I mean, I enjoy every piece of food.

Guest (2:00:16.280)

So it's like, it's if you can enjoy the full lifestyle, it's not just the particular experience,

Guest (2:00:23.840)

but like the full journey.

Guest (2:00:26.120)

Does it fit your lifestyle?

Guest (2:00:29.480)

So let me ask about a complicated topic that's sometimes a bit controversial, which is steroids

Guest (2:00:37.080)

and maybe TRT, testosterone replacement therapy.

Guest (2:00:42.040)

What role does that play in strength training?

Guest (2:00:44.000)

All right.

Guest (2:00:45.460)

We're going to go there.

Guest (2:00:47.200)

Let's go there.

Guest (2:00:48.200)

Yeah.

Guest (2:00:49.200)

But it's an important discussion to have.

Guest (2:00:52.580)

I think that it's something that I can be more transparent on.

Guest (2:00:58.000)

In my past, I wasn't able to do to the career that I had.

Guest (2:01:01.740)

So just like covering that stuff in a, you know, one of the, on a public forum when you're

Guest (2:01:09.080)

highly looked at being an executive for recruiting and other stuff, like it was an area I had

Guest (2:01:14.600)

to just kind of pass on, right?

Guest (2:01:18.640)

Now I've used steroids.

Guest (2:01:21.680)

I've used them since I was 33 and I basically just use TRT now after my big squat.

Guest (2:01:30.480)

So for 10 years I used them and there's some interesting components to this.

Guest (2:01:38.080)

So one is just the gray area of what we call performance enhancing supplements.

Guest (2:01:44.560)

So performance was a PEDs that the line of what defines a PED is ever shifting and it's

Guest (2:01:55.200)

shifting based on society norms, cultural norms, government body agencies, all these

Guest (2:02:00.800)

sorts of stuff.

Guest (2:02:01.800)

So I'm not making excuses here.

Guest (2:02:03.040)

So I just want to elaborate before I actually start digging into the details here because

Guest (2:02:08.080)

performance enhancing, I could take sodium bicarbonate and enhance my ability to perform

Guest (2:02:15.600)

deadlifts for reps.

Guest (2:02:17.160)

Guess what?

Guest (2:02:18.160)

I did that for my Guinness world record for deadlifts in a minute.

Guest (2:02:20.680)

Okay.

Guest (2:02:21.680)

People do it for rowing or other, they use a high capacity type stuff.

Guest (2:02:27.040)

It is performance enhancing.

Guest (2:02:28.680)

It is a chemical, it is baking soda, all right?

Guest (2:02:35.200)

They're not able to make it illegal because everybody eats bread, well, not everyone.

Guest (2:02:40.440)

And so it's a little hard to test for no matter what you do at any level.

Guest (2:02:45.280)

So that's an extreme example, but other examples, you're drinking an energy drink in that cup

Guest (2:02:51.140)

there a little while ago and in America you can get an energy drink with 240 milligrams

Guest (2:02:56.440)

of caffeine in it.

Guest (2:02:57.920)

In Canada, that's too dangerous.

Guest (2:03:00.060)

You can only get 140, but you can go buy a ephedra and ephedra is illegal in America.

Guest (2:03:07.200)

And so these things bounce back and forth all the time.

Guest (2:03:10.400)

I could take Yohimbi and in Europe or Australia, it is a drug and classified and America, it

Guest (2:03:20.160)

is not.

Guest (2:03:21.160)

It's an herbal root in a lot, I actually have one of my supplements except for the overseas

Guest (2:03:26.480)

version.

Guest (2:03:27.480)

Anyway, the point I'm getting is no matter what you do at some point, by someone's standards,

Guest (2:03:34.920)

you are cheating.

Guest (2:03:37.600)

And because it is, you're taking something that, but you could work around these things

Guest (2:03:44.280)

with nutritional ways or other ways versus taking a chemical strip and there's whole

Guest (2:03:48.480)

lots of ways to do this, but it's like, oh no, it's steroids, it's not, it's injectable,

Guest (2:03:52.080)

it's not.

Guest (2:03:53.080)

So somewhere there's a culture or a person that will say you're cheating no matter what.

Guest (2:03:57.780)

So it's a self defined, you need to define it for yourself unless you're competing in

Guest (2:04:01.760)

an organization that has testing, then it's a straight ethical thing and it's either right

Guest (2:04:07.440)

or wrong in my opinion.

Guest (2:04:10.400)

That's kind of the overall dilemma of it is if you want to see what you're totally capable

Guest (2:04:16.560)

of, you have to decide yourself what's okay or not to that level.

Guest (2:04:24.480)

There is no body that can say something yes or no.

Guest (2:04:29.480)

When there's an event like the Olympics, maybe then you have a standard that you're all trying

Guest (2:04:34.580)

to adhere to and then it makes sense to keep a certain, like to be within, there's an ethical

Guest (2:04:40.160)

imperative.

Guest (2:04:41.160)

So yeah, I'm not talking about that, I'm agreeing to compete in this by these rules.

Guest (2:04:46.800)

Yeah, but when you're trying to maximize your own performance, whatever that journey is,

Guest (2:04:51.840)

whatever that goal is, that's a different story and it's not easy to figure that out.

Guest (2:04:57.920)

You're just like dancing around the subject, whatever.

Guest (2:05:00.800)

Well guess what, I've got a prescription for growth hormone and testosterone.

Guest (2:05:06.080)

It's legal for me to take and you know what?

Guest (2:05:08.960)

A lot of the people that are in front of the camera in the media, politicians and news

Guest (2:05:14.160)

people and the people that are there saying the no drug stuff, they're going to anti aging

Guest (2:05:19.960)

clinics to look better and they have a prescription for growth hormone and testosterone themselves.

Guest (2:05:26.000)

But in their eyes, it's okay.

Guest (2:05:28.880)

It is a prescription from their doctor because they have the money to do it.

Guest (2:05:34.680)

So it's legal and it's fine.

Guest (2:05:37.800)

If I is interesting in Oregon, anybody and I don't know what other states over the age

Guest (2:05:44.280)

of 16 can without parents permission by the way, walk into a gender clinic and as a female

Guest (2:05:51.440)

and get a prescription for testosterone.

Guest (2:05:54.520)

But as an athlete, if I've got low testosterone, I am so flow, I've got depression, I can't

Guest (2:06:02.560)

have sex with my wife.

Guest (2:06:04.000)

It's affecting my quality of life.

Guest (2:06:05.880)

I will have to fight tooth and nail to get testosterone just as a prescription and then

Guest (2:06:11.160)

I will get kicked out of my organization for competing.

Guest (2:06:15.880)

So you understand how gray this stuff gets.

Guest (2:06:18.120)

Do you think the stigma on testosterone is the reason we're not having like a healthy

Guest (2:06:23.760)

conversation about when it's proper?

Guest (2:06:26.360)

Like what are the proper uses of testosterone in an athlete's life and just the regular

Guest (2:06:30.640)

human life?

Guest (2:06:32.000)

Yeah, absolutely.

Guest (2:06:34.240)

And it's just, it's like anything.

Guest (2:06:35.760)

It's like I said, it is lines that we pick and draw.

Guest (2:06:38.960)

Anytime you put that out there, people are going to have different opinions where those

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lines are.

Guest (2:06:43.440)

So now when it comes to strength, here's an interesting thing.

Guest (2:06:46.160)

In powerlifting, there's tested federations and non tested federations.

Guest (2:06:50.040)

So we can literally look at the statistical data and actually find out what do steroids

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do.

Guest (2:06:56.620)

And so it's pretty clear that steroids provide about a 10% increase in strength on average

Guest (2:07:03.160)

over not.

Guest (2:07:04.880)

Now that does take out the fact that steroids will put you in, allow you to put on more

Guest (2:07:09.040)

mass so you'll go up a weight class a lot of times.

Guest (2:07:12.920)

So as a whole, you could definitely lift more probably than the 10% over time, right?

Guest (2:07:19.560)

And then we think about steroids as the ability to just put on muscle.

Guest (2:07:23.400)

And here's where things get a little interesting, even with people that use steroids is not

Guest (2:07:27.400)

understanding the neurological impacts that steroids have.

Guest (2:07:31.360)

Because you could take some steroids right now and be stronger in 10 minutes.

Guest (2:07:36.920)

That's clearly not done anything, you know, from a physiology standpoint to make you stronger.

Guest (2:07:42.140)

But we have a tapped in neurologically to to elicit those games.

Guest (2:07:46.920)

And there's a whole lot that happens neurologically.

Guest (2:07:49.480)

Like how much science is there in terms of all the different ways you could take steroids,

Guest (2:07:56.320)

which kinds of steroids, the timing, the dose, the all of those things to develop the neurological,

Guest (2:08:03.080)

the physical, the skeletal, like all the, you know, you've talked with such depth about

Guest (2:08:08.080)

the science of strength building in terms of form, in terms of the equipment that you

Guest (2:08:16.080)

use.

Guest (2:08:17.080)

It seems like a component, you know, the use of steroids should be an equal level of scientific

Guest (2:08:24.120)

rigor when applying them.

Guest (2:08:26.040)

It is.

Guest (2:08:27.040)

Now, the research is harder to get because of what it is.

Guest (2:08:32.240)

But there is a lot of research that was done when they were legal.

Guest (2:08:36.320)

So they were legal up in through the through, I think, the mid 80s.

Guest (2:08:40.240)

And so a lot of the classical high, high benefit to low risk steroids were studied.

Guest (2:08:48.680)

And then since then, there's a lot of like designer steroids or new steroids that have

Guest (2:08:52.320)

come up that don't have a lot of research around safety and risk and things of that

Guest (2:08:58.040)

nature.

Guest (2:08:59.040)

And we can't do that because it's, you know, because of the legality around these things.

Guest (2:09:04.360)

But some of the stuff on the neurological function is really just understanding how

Guest (2:09:09.040)

that chemical structure works and what it's doing to the neurotransmitters, what it's

Guest (2:09:15.040)

doing.

Guest (2:09:17.060)

And so some of it is is really talking to people that have experience with it.

Guest (2:09:23.920)

And the other is understanding those structures and what they do.

Guest (2:09:27.020)

The neurological component, I think, is more interesting than than most, because the most

Guest (2:09:33.600)

steroids act through increasing muscle protein synthesis.

Guest (2:09:37.080)

That's how you add more muscle is they have an anti catabolic effect and they have a muscle

Guest (2:09:42.700)

protein synthesis enhancing effect.

Guest (2:09:45.440)

So it reduces the amount of muscle that you waste and increases the amount of muscle that

Guest (2:09:49.560)

you put on.

Guest (2:09:51.520)

But the neurological component is is tremendously valuable for what it can do for your training

Guest (2:09:59.120)

workout.

Guest (2:10:00.120)

Like if I handle more load over time, I'm going to make more progress.

Guest (2:10:04.760)

If I can actually just stimulate more neurological effects for a specific event, it's going to

Guest (2:10:09.040)

have an impact.

Guest (2:10:10.920)

Right.

Guest (2:10:11.920)

But there's other ways that you can tap into this, too.

Guest (2:10:14.520)

Things that you can tap into mentally with great practice, with meditation and other

Guest (2:10:18.040)

stuff that will have the same effect.

Guest (2:10:21.680)

People probably think I'm over speaking, especially steroid users that are listening to this.

Guest (2:10:25.480)

Well, at least I'm talking out my ass, but I'm not.

Guest (2:10:29.400)

Because I I have experience with this stuff on both ends.

Guest (2:10:34.920)

And some of those areas, a lot of people don't have the experience with that.

Guest (2:10:39.360)

What I've kind of heard from people is the confidence that comes with steroids.

Guest (2:10:44.800)

It feels like not to call it placebo, but it seems like the psychological benefits of

Guest (2:10:50.280)

steroids is huge and that you feel like there's a confidence that seems to be coupled with

Guest (2:10:57.840)

the actual biological and chemical effects.

Guest (2:11:00.440)

I have actually a neurological condition.

Guest (2:11:03.300)

So I actually don't feel a lot of that stuff that people because there are certain steroids

Guest (2:11:06.860)

that like people like you're like very extreme ones, like that would make somebody bite someone's

Guest (2:11:14.680)

ear off in a fight, for example, almost like aggression that and they literally do nothing.

Guest (2:11:21.120)

I'm like always just chillin and I don't like that effect.

Guest (2:11:26.840)

But but neurologically, they're still having those effects, but I don't get those feels

Guest (2:11:31.040)

that other people have from those.

Guest (2:11:34.340)

But yes, there's that immediate boost in aggression and a confidence and stuff that come with

Guest (2:11:39.800)

a lot of those ones that deal on the neurological overall as good sense of well being, just

Guest (2:11:44.800)

like from being on testosterone, like it's going to affect your mood.

Guest (2:11:49.120)

And it's interesting.

Guest (2:11:50.120)

So testosterone replacement therapy, if we walk down that path now and kind of switch

Guest (2:11:53.960)

gears, you know, we find that men today have declining testosterone over what has historically

Guest (2:12:02.000)

been in the past.

Guest (2:12:03.000)

So right now, I think a thirty five year old testosterone is shown to be about half what

Guest (2:12:08.960)

it was just 50 years ago.

Guest (2:12:12.540)

So I don't know if we could argue the point.

Guest (2:12:15.660)

We don't really have the science to validate any of it, but it could be society as far

Guest (2:12:21.360)

as the impact that it's having on the mental health for men.

Guest (2:12:26.840)

It could be the the estrogens floating around in the water from all the chemicals and birth

Guest (2:12:31.720)

control and all this sort of stuff could be a lot of things.

Guest (2:12:36.640)

But it is a fact that average testosterone is significantly lower and that is going to

Guest (2:12:42.080)

end up affecting life, quality of life, as well as your longevity, because it will affect

Guest (2:12:47.040)

those things.

Guest (2:12:48.040)

But on the other end, steroids and TRT, particularly steroids, come with a lot of negative health

Guest (2:12:53.000)

benefits, not benefits, a lot of negative health ramifications.

Guest (2:12:58.160)

And so, you know, if I knew what I know now, I don't know that I would have gone that path.

Guest (2:13:02.760)

I didn't.

Guest (2:13:03.760)

I didn't till I was thirty three, which is kind of an outlier for a strength athlete.

Guest (2:13:07.560)

I was I was a four times body weight deadlifter, eight hundred plus pounds at one ninety eight.

Guest (2:13:13.680)

And it's pretty dang strong before I went down that path.

Guest (2:13:18.720)

And that's because I wanted to see what I was capable of.

Guest (2:13:21.100)

But I was reaching a point that it was either I need to do that or not.

Guest (2:13:24.640)

My testosterone, my natural testosterone levels were actually I think below 300 is actually

Guest (2:13:30.480)

the threshold.

Guest (2:13:31.480)

So I was being told to go on TRT for the last couple of years, probably just because I was

Guest (2:13:35.640)

pushing so hard and the stress level was driving my test down.

Guest (2:13:38.600)

So it was self imposed more than likely.

Guest (2:13:41.700)

But I put it off because I wanted to set all the drug free records and I set the ones that

Guest (2:13:46.000)

I wanted.

Guest (2:13:47.000)

And then it was thirty three.

Guest (2:13:48.000)

I'm, you know, entering the age category and I'm like, I'm going to go on TRT.

Guest (2:13:52.200)

I did not feel like I should be with TRT personally.

Guest (2:13:55.680)

My ethical standard was I shouldn't be competing in tested events anymore.

Guest (2:14:00.600)

There are federations that will allow you with your you show up with your script and

Guest (2:14:04.180)

you do your test and you're below a certain level, but you're still on.

Guest (2:14:08.100)

But for me, I'm like, that's not you.

Guest (2:14:09.520)

So I'm like, I may as well at this point use steroids.

Guest (2:14:15.140)

But since then, you know, understanding all those ramifications, you know, I might not

Guest (2:14:19.880)

have gone down that route quite so fast and easily.

Guest (2:14:24.280)

But I continued because I also have a lot of resources that other people don't and being

Guest (2:14:29.340)

able to assess and understand and put things in place to mitigate that.

Guest (2:14:32.840)

So you need to be.

Guest (2:14:33.880)

And the other thing is, once you go on, it's literally a decision for life.

Guest (2:14:39.240)

Not just but realistically is because your your quality of life, your feeling is going

Guest (2:14:45.480)

to be enhanced quite a bit and you're not going to want to go back.

Guest (2:14:49.180)

And if you go back, it's going to be less than it was before.

Guest (2:14:53.120)

That's how the endocrine system works.

Guest (2:14:54.900)

There are ways to try to recover and bring that up, but it might be a while.

Guest (2:14:58.600)

And if you've been on for a while, it definitely is not an option.

Guest (2:15:02.000)

So those are big things that people need to understand that you're going to have some

Guest (2:15:06.480)

things in there.

Guest (2:15:07.480)

And even TRT has some potential, especially at higher levels, that it's going to, you

Guest (2:15:15.160)

know, increase the risk for prostate cancer.

Guest (2:15:18.180)

It's going to potentially cause some hypertrophy of the left ventricle of the heart and some

Guest (2:15:24.160)

potential plaque buildup of some of those key arteries around there that's going to

Guest (2:15:27.720)

have an impact on your cardiovascular health.

Guest (2:15:30.800)

There's things that you can do again, but everything is like the shoe story, right?

Guest (2:15:35.160)

Where I'm anti anti shoe, but I'm going, well, we could put band aids on this.

Guest (2:15:40.440)

So it's...

Guest (2:15:41.440)

But there's a quality of life that comes with it, the increase in quality of life.

Guest (2:15:45.840)

And if you do it correctly, I think for me, for me, I definitely would not live without

Guest (2:15:50.040)

TRT, even with knowing what I know now.

Guest (2:15:53.120)

It this age and the quality of life and being able to be there, have the energy, the recovery.

Guest (2:16:00.840)

That's a big thing where all this, though, I talked about muscle protein synthesis and

Guest (2:16:04.920)

anti catabolism as being big drivers.

Guest (2:16:07.560)

But recovery is the other big aspect that they that they offer probably as a result

Guest (2:16:12.640)

of those, but that's going to those are going to be the big enhancement.

Guest (2:16:17.240)

So just doing steroids, steroids is going to increase all the other stuff that you do.

Guest (2:16:23.840)

So if you if you have good training, if good diet, good quality of sleep, like all this

Guest (2:16:28.000)

other stuff, then you can take advantage of that.

Guest (2:16:31.280)

But you could choose steroids and nobody would know.

Guest (2:16:35.280)

And honestly, you go down to 24 hour fitness and you'll see a bunch of, you know, late,

Guest (2:16:39.760)

you know, 19 to 21 year old kids that are all kind of red and one hundred and fifty

Guest (2:16:43.380)

pounds that look like that don't look like anything.

Guest (2:16:46.440)

And they're a bunch of them will be using steroids because they're not like.

Guest (2:16:52.600)

So it's it's not the it's not going to make a champion, like you said, it's not going

Guest (2:16:56.700)

to at most.

Guest (2:16:58.160)

Guess what?

Guest (2:16:59.160)

I was already at an elite level.

Guest (2:17:00.160)

I was one of the best in the world before I started using it doesn't it doesn't do that.

Guest (2:17:05.960)

It does a 10 percent increase at best.

Guest (2:17:08.840)

And that's proven in the statistics, which is interesting because most people don't know

Guest (2:17:11.400)

this.

Guest (2:17:12.400)

Like it the data is right there.

Guest (2:17:15.120)

Yeah.

Guest (2:17:16.120)

Yeah.

Guest (2:17:17.120)

And that's why I'm often saddened by maybe the negative view of somebody like Lance Armstrong,

Guest (2:17:27.760)

who is one of the greatest athletes in history and everybody else that he was competing against.

Guest (2:17:33.360)

I'm sorry.

Guest (2:17:34.360)

Yeah.

Guest (2:17:35.360)

I hate to blow anybody's bubble.

Guest (2:17:36.960)

But regardless, if I told you my ethical pieces with saying that you're going to be at something

Guest (2:17:41.380)

at an elite level.

Guest (2:17:44.840)

You look at most a lot of those big figures out there.

Guest (2:17:49.120)

When their income in your life relies on it, yeah, you're going to push those limits.

Guest (2:17:53.020)

So maybe maybe my ethical would change if if if I was in that position, too, because

Guest (2:17:58.600)

here's the thing where I believe like someone is.

Guest (2:18:02.880)

I think people should avoid steroids.

Guest (2:18:05.400)

TRT, probably something worth taking a look at what your levels are when you're in the

Guest (2:18:10.400)

thirty five to forty five range and see what decision you decide to make from there.

Guest (2:18:14.160)

And that's a decision that you make for the rest of your life.

Guest (2:18:16.600)

The only times that you should be taking a look at steroids is if it's it's funding your

Guest (2:18:21.440)

life.

Guest (2:18:22.440)

It's creating that it is your job and it's doing like and honestly, it was for me.

Guest (2:18:28.000)

I so was it the only thing?

Guest (2:18:30.760)

No, no.

Guest (2:18:31.760)

If you want to get into neurology, it's neurotransmitters and alcohol is really interesting discussion

Guest (2:18:38.320)

on performance enhancement.

Guest (2:18:39.880)

So when I lift heavy and so I always promote it, like not more than a drink or two, like

Guest (2:18:45.400)

once or twice a month is what all I'm talking about when I'm what I'm saying.

Guest (2:18:48.840)

So what's the timing of the drink?

Guest (2:18:50.600)

Are we talking about three to five minutes before?

Guest (2:18:53.520)

Yes.

Guest (2:18:54.520)

And we're talking about beer.

Guest (2:18:56.440)

It doesn't matter the the source.

Guest (2:18:58.680)

So I shots are the easiest.

Guest (2:19:01.560)

You want something that is not going to have some sort of regurgitory effect or bloating

Guest (2:19:05.680)

effect or anything like that, but you want to have the quick hit of energy.

Guest (2:19:09.520)

So it's a preferential energy source moves above ketones, carbs, everything at seven

Guest (2:19:14.800)

calories per gram.

Guest (2:19:15.880)

But then there's some really interesting things that happen, spikes blood pressure, which

Guest (2:19:19.720)

is going to make weights feel lighter.

Guest (2:19:21.660)

So when you're in your early 20s and you're trying to hit up, you know, some attractive

Guest (2:19:26.240)

person at the bar, you're with your buddies and you're like, you know, and you got second

Guest (2:19:30.980)

guess.

Guest (2:19:31.980)

Oh, should I?

Guest (2:19:32.980)

Should I?

Guest (2:19:33.980)

And they go, have a shot of liquid courage and you have one.

Guest (2:19:36.880)

And all of a sudden the second thoughts, the second guessing all that drops away.

Guest (2:19:41.560)

Like you're focused in the moment and you walk over and you actually perform a little

Guest (2:19:46.040)

better like conversation wise than you normally would.

Guest (2:19:48.200)

Now if you have five or six and then go over, you're gonna make a fool of yourself.

Guest (2:19:51.000)

So it's all about timing and amount.

Guest (2:19:52.720)

But there is a reason that that happens.

Guest (2:19:54.560)

So anyway, I'm known for promoting this whiskey and deadlift concept.

Guest (2:19:58.320)

I love this.

Guest (2:19:59.320)

But it works.

Guest (2:20:00.320)

It's like the Eastern block.

Guest (2:20:01.960)

That's where it came.

Guest (2:20:02.960)

That's where I stole it from.

Guest (2:20:03.960)

Because I was watching all these Russian lifters would have a shot of vodka or something before

Guest (2:20:08.720)

they go lift.

Guest (2:20:09.720)

And I'm like, there's something here.

Guest (2:20:11.280)

So I started experimenting with it and I'm like, that works.

Guest (2:20:14.920)

And then I started researching.

Guest (2:20:16.000)

Nobody talks about this stuff.

Guest (2:20:17.200)

So it takes a while to start piecing together all the stuff that actually happens to make

Guest (2:20:21.360)

that happen.

Guest (2:20:22.540)

But it moves away the things that you're going to, the concerns about the ramifications in

Guest (2:20:28.280)

the future and the other stuff.

Guest (2:20:29.600)

So the, um, but brings you into the moment and then the dopamine hit and the other, and

Guest (2:20:34.960)

then it enhances whatever mood that you're in.

Guest (2:20:37.560)

But all of a sudden you get in the state much easier.

Guest (2:20:45.060)

And so it's really, really interesting, but it's very, it's a very small amount needed

Guest (2:20:49.840)

and very time sensitive, but it can be so much more powerful than like drugs people

Guest (2:20:55.000)

use for this stuff.

Guest (2:20:57.140)

It ties really together with meditative state and other pieces to, to, to get you into that

Guest (2:21:01.800)

flow state, those thoughts about failure, what if, what, like all that you, you get

Guest (2:21:07.480)

into that zone, that moment, that time anyway.

Guest (2:21:13.040)

So interesting.

Guest (2:21:14.040)

An alcoholic is promoting out, you know, but there's an important point here, which not

Guest (2:21:18.640)

often talked about.

Guest (2:21:19.640)

I think it is fascinating that because you can get into so much trouble with alcohol

Guest (2:21:24.240)

when used in excess, people don't often talk about the, the positive aspects of alcohol,

Guest (2:21:29.640)

even in your college years.

Guest (2:21:34.280)

It had a, it had a lasting effect on who I am as a person.

Guest (2:21:37.440)

I don't think people give enough credit to the positive aspect.

Guest (2:21:41.080)

See, you could have accomplished a lot of those same things with a little more moderation,

Guest (2:21:45.320)

which I think people should talk about more, which is like the way to open up a personality,

Guest (2:21:50.920)

like the flowering of the full character and the weirdness and the, the, the, like the

Guest (2:21:56.720)

beauty of who you are as a human being could be opened up with alcohol.

Guest (2:22:00.160)

And that's really interesting to think about.

Guest (2:22:01.800)

You should try some podcasts with a, with a shot and, and these, I do this sometimes

Guest (2:22:10.080)

with myself and guests and it will change the conversation, lubricates the conversation.

Guest (2:22:15.600)

Definitely not the excess and which is what I learned because I went all the way in because

Guest (2:22:20.080)

I do everything at extremes.

Guest (2:22:22.160)

So it was a really hard lesson that took me a lot of time to unwind, but it is interesting

Guest (2:22:28.840)

and people don't discuss those things because it's, it's either this or this.

Guest (2:22:33.160)

You're one of the greatest strength athletes of all time.

Guest (2:22:37.020)

So it's worthwhile to consider how you optimize the, the feats of strength that you reach

Guest (2:22:43.760)

for with things like steroids.

Guest (2:22:47.080)

It makes perfect sense and I think that was a, from my perspective, I think it was probably

Guest (2:22:52.120)

the right decision.

Guest (2:22:53.120)

You've achieved something incredible that inspires a huge number of people.

Guest (2:22:58.640)

That's it.

Guest (2:22:59.640)

And you've shown to yourself and to the world, but what the human body can accomplish.

Guest (2:23:03.360)

Yep.

Guest (2:23:04.360)

That's incredible.

Guest (2:23:05.360)

And no matter if I push to a less weight and if I disclosed everything that I did and

Guest (2:23:10.360)

I didn't, when I wasn't using steroids, in my opinion, if we went through everything,

Guest (2:23:15.400)

there would people that would say, you're using performance enhancing, no matter what,

Guest (2:23:18.760)

like it is, it's straight up.

Guest (2:23:20.480)

So you just need to be okay with it yourself.

Guest (2:23:22.320)

And so I had to make the call, I want to see what the true potential is of every, let's

Guest (2:23:27.980)

throw everything out the window that I feel unless I feel it's a risk from a, from a health

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standpoint that I'm not willing to take on.

Guest (2:23:36.040)

And because that's, how do I like, it's just picking and choosing and it's just picking

Guest (2:23:41.520)

and choosing.

Guest (2:23:42.520)

I here's what I want to know.

Guest (2:23:43.920)

This is what I want to be able to try to achieve.

Guest (2:23:45.880)

And so, yeah, yeah, that's what I did.

Guest (2:23:48.760)

And what you did is incredible.

Guest (2:23:50.680)

Like it's, it's just awe inspiring.

Guest (2:23:52.400)

And what Lance Armstrong did was incredible.

Guest (2:23:54.400)

Yeah.

Guest (2:23:55.400)

And that, and that, and that aged me up.

Guest (2:23:57.160)

And what's funny is the people that bash them are like on the media or politicians or maybe

Guest (2:24:01.040)

some actors and guess what?

Guest (2:24:03.320)

A ton of them are doing the same thing.

Guest (2:24:06.560)

It's hypocrisy at its finest.

Guest (2:24:08.080)

Trust me.

Guest (2:24:09.080)

But how many, how many of those figures you're watching in movies that love to talk, you

Guest (2:24:13.320)

know, be, you know, be political and do this and the news and all this, I'm telling you

Guest (2:24:18.800)

they're, they're anti aging clinics, like all over California and everywhere else.

Guest (2:24:26.240)

Who do you think is, keeps them in business?

Guest (2:24:28.760)

It's not the competitive lifter.

Guest (2:24:29.920)

I'll tell you that.

Guest (2:24:30.920)

And they're using peptides and also, and SARMs and all sorts of like.

Guest (2:24:38.000)

You're speaking to the hypocrisy.

Guest (2:24:39.480)

I also want to speak to the fact, you know, somebody who's a friend of mine, David Goggins.

Guest (2:24:44.040)

I don't know if you know what that is.

Guest (2:24:45.040)

Yeah.

Guest (2:24:46.040)

Ultra marathon runner, Navy seal.

Guest (2:24:48.500)

He gets.

Guest (2:24:49.500)

Pretty incredible person.

Guest (2:24:50.500)

Yeah.

Guest (2:24:51.500)

Incredible human being.

Guest (2:24:52.500)

And he gets criticism like, you know, what you're doing is, is bad for the body.

Guest (2:24:56.800)

You know, you're, you're pushing yourself too far.

Guest (2:25:00.760)

I find that the people that criticize are often people that haven't truly pushed themselves

Guest (2:25:07.160)

to the limit.

Guest (2:25:08.160)

They haven't actually worked hard in their life.

Guest (2:25:11.220)

When you work hard, you realize how incredible it is that a human being can dedicate themselves

Guest (2:25:18.300)

so fully to an effort the way you did, the way David Goggins does the way, the way the

Guest (2:25:25.760)

greatest athletes do.

Guest (2:25:27.740)

And there's nothing that should be said beyond just sitting back in awe that humans can achieve

Guest (2:25:33.720)

that.

Guest (2:25:34.720)

That inspires me to do the best, whatever the hell I do, to be the best version of that.

Guest (2:25:40.160)

There's something about like athletic feats, especially like strength that just inspire

Guest (2:25:47.520)

us to do the best, to be the best version of ourselves.

Guest (2:25:51.460)

I don't know.

Guest (2:25:52.600)

That's the only thing you should be saying as opposed to criticizing some little detail

Guest (2:25:58.820)

of this and that.

Guest (2:26:00.600)

It's just awe inspiring that you push yourself to anybody that is at that level.

Guest (2:26:05.520)

And this is funny, like in competitive sports, like you go online and people, it's just bash,

Guest (2:26:09.320)

bash, bash, bash, bash, bash, bash.

Guest (2:26:10.880)

You go talk to anybody, anybody, anybody that's a high level athlete within that field.

Guest (2:26:16.920)

And nobody has a single bad thing to say about each other.

Guest (2:26:20.220)

But all this chitter chatter down there, I mean, I know exactly what you're saying.

Guest (2:26:25.360)

So if you, I would say, cause I have love for all those folks, especially when you're

Guest (2:26:30.840)

younger, you have a little bit of that desire to criticize others.

Guest (2:26:36.440)

I think that should be channeled in improving your own life.

Guest (2:26:40.120)

Anytime that you feel that way, that is when you need to turn inward and it's hard to do,

Guest (2:26:46.840)

but there is a reason that you have those emotions around someone else and what they're

Guest (2:26:53.040)

doing that you have an opportunity to look at yourself and know why you feel that way.

Guest (2:27:00.680)

And that, guess what?

Guest (2:27:01.720)

That's going to be the hard thing to do.

Guest (2:27:02.940)

That's going to be the thing.

Guest (2:27:03.940)

Again, that's stirring you a little bit because it's so much easier to sit there and, or talk

Guest (2:27:09.400)

to your confidant or whatever instead of go, why does that bother me?

Guest (2:27:14.620)

Why does what that person doing or what that person's achieving bother me?

Guest (2:27:19.600)

It's like a difficult question that I often ask others, whether it's better to work hard

Guest (2:27:29.600)

or work smart.

Guest (2:27:31.200)

I like to ask that question because it helps me get a sense of the human being.

Guest (2:27:36.960)

And I think I, let me just say like, I often, I often like people that answer that would

Guest (2:27:45.800)

work hard.

Guest (2:27:49.800)

Even though the quote unquote right answer is work smart, meaning like finding the optimal

Guest (2:27:56.480)

efficient way to achieve a certain goal, I find that people that answer work smart don't

Guest (2:28:03.680)

actually find the optimal efficient way to achieve a goal.

Guest (2:28:08.660)

It seems like the people that at least certainly early in life strive to work their ass off,

Guest (2:28:15.060)

even that means doing the inefficient, the dumb thing, just to learn the mistake.

Guest (2:28:21.000)

The spirit behind the human spirit behind the person that says, or a card is the one

Guest (2:28:27.360)

I connect with, but I'm torn, especially in the, in the war culture, in the tech sector

Guest (2:28:31.640)

where people answer work smart, what would you, what would you say about that tension?

Guest (2:28:38.220)

This definitely encompasses like, I'm the intellectual and I'm the meathead.

Guest (2:28:44.160)

I'm the work around the clock and go fix the processes and make it so much better type

Guest (2:28:51.800)

person.

Guest (2:28:52.800)

Right.

Guest (2:28:53.800)

That's, that's, that's me in a whole, that's everything.

Guest (2:28:54.800)

That's my life story.

Guest (2:28:55.800)

Right.

Guest (2:28:56.800)

Busting your ass to find the easiest way possible to both.

Guest (2:29:00.920)

So like I will, I will build a custom hydraulic cart that will lift my plates up to the height

Guest (2:29:11.120)

of my, my squat.

Guest (2:29:14.120)

So that I can minimize a roll it over next to it and then minimize the effort of it going

Guest (2:29:18.280)

on and off to be able to lift the most amount of weight as possible so, so that I can save

Guest (2:29:26.120)

the energy from here, from lifting those up and the fatigue of my back being in bad position.

Guest (2:29:31.100)

So I can nearly kill myself over here.

Guest (2:29:35.040)

Right.

Guest (2:29:36.360)

I, my wife, anybody will say, I'm a workaholic.

Guest (2:29:42.320)

And the first thing that I would do when it would be doing a company, a company turnaround,

Guest (2:29:47.520)

they'd hire me, come in and I would be taking over.

Guest (2:29:49.960)

So for someone that wasn't successful, but it was usually hardly ever for lack of want

Guest (2:29:54.800)

or trying.

Guest (2:29:55.800)

So a lot of times they knew they were unsuccessful and they were running around working six,

Guest (2:30:00.000)

seven days a week, 12 hour days doing so much and it'd be like, well, you need to do this.

Guest (2:30:05.320)

And they train me on like all the reports and this and all the things and like, good

Guest (2:30:09.520)

luck, good luck.

Guest (2:30:11.440)

I couldn't do it.

Guest (2:30:12.880)

And the first thing I would do is nothing.

Guest (2:30:17.720)

I would do nothing because then I would find what actually keeps coming back, the things

Guest (2:30:27.800)

that I need to do and how much of it was filling the space.

Guest (2:30:31.820)

Because so much of human nature when you're failing is to make yourself feel like you're

Guest (2:30:37.760)

accomplishing thing.

Guest (2:30:38.940)

This is when things go on your list, on your checklist and you start like rolling up.

Guest (2:30:44.080)

So you're running around just getting shit done.

Guest (2:30:47.240)

Yeah.

Guest (2:30:48.240)

Being busy.

Guest (2:30:49.240)

Right.

Guest (2:30:50.240)

And so, but at the same time, like find somewhere in my career, something I've done where I

Guest (2:30:57.520)

haven't outworked everybody, just so much on distilling things down to what's important.

Guest (2:31:04.200)

And you've got to make time to sit back and assess and think and be introspective.

Guest (2:31:14.380)

You have to make time for this because if not, you're going to waste so much time sitting

Guest (2:31:20.400)

there walking sideways when all you got to do is move just one step in front of the other

Guest (2:31:28.200)

each day.

Guest (2:31:29.200)

Just one.

Guest (2:31:30.200)

And I say, because it's going to add up, but you could spend six months knocking shit out,

Guest (2:31:38.240)

doing your routine, busting your ass and not take that one step.

Guest (2:31:44.520)

So you've got to distill stuff down.

Guest (2:31:46.960)

You've got to really understand like what's important to you in life and where you're

Guest (2:31:50.600)

going.

Guest (2:31:51.600)

And, uh, when you're looking at anything in your life, the first thing that you need to

Guest (2:31:55.880)

do is figure out, do I need to do it and just quit doing it, just quit doing things in your

Guest (2:32:02.920)

life.

Guest (2:32:03.920)

And you'll see that a lot of stuff that you think has to be done, doesn't have to be done.

Guest (2:32:11.440)

You'd be surprised.

Guest (2:32:14.000)

And then from there, this is the tech.

Guest (2:32:15.480)

Okay.

Guest (2:32:16.480)

And then of that, what can I, what can I automate?

Guest (2:32:19.560)

What can I not have to do in a repeated fashion?

Guest (2:32:23.320)

And then the last one, yeah, wherever possible, if it's not something that I'm adding tremendous

Guest (2:32:28.260)

value to, like my uniqueness, people are like, oh, you must like do the auto work on your

Guest (2:32:32.920)

vehicles cause you love working.

Guest (2:32:34.080)

I'm like, fuck that.

Guest (2:32:35.080)

I don't.

Guest (2:32:36.080)

And they're like, what?

Guest (2:32:37.080)

That doesn't make any sense.

Guest (2:32:38.080)

And I'm like, no, I love creating things, but I don't want to do that stuff.

Guest (2:32:44.700)

So you could use delegating if you're a manager position, but it's outsourcing, whatever it

Guest (2:32:50.560)

is.

Guest (2:32:51.560)

But there are also so many things this, and this, this ties back to your point, uh, around

Guest (2:32:56.800)

just doing it.

Guest (2:32:58.440)

There's a point to like experiencing all levels to really understand things.

Guest (2:33:03.120)

You need to spend time at the same time doing all those things.

Guest (2:33:07.640)

Cause there could be good, huge, massive gaps in there that you're not aware of that are

Guest (2:33:13.320)

key for you or key to be having done different or so on.

Guest (2:33:17.360)

So um, like in my company days, I was one of the few executives that came in that could

Guest (2:33:24.600)

do anything on the floor from code to machine, run away, the mill weld, do all step into

Guest (2:33:31.840)

engineering, like, and, and that added tremendous value to me to having had spent time being

Guest (2:33:40.080)

a doer and not enough people want to be, you've got to just go do shit.

Guest (2:33:45.760)

You need to spend time in your life chopping wood, you need to have experience trying and

Guest (2:33:52.000)

doing all these things that you would never like my skillset is massive because I want

Guest (2:33:58.720)

to know, like you need to have those touch points.

Guest (2:34:01.960)

My job, my title is chief visionary, but I've spent time doing everything.

Guest (2:34:12.000)

It's not about just like creating this amazing strategy or vision.

Guest (2:34:16.080)

And I'm just going to be there in this person that directs and like, like you can't be effective.

Guest (2:34:21.260)

You cannot connect the dots unless you've been in the moment with everything.

Guest (2:34:27.080)

Yeah.

Guest (2:34:28.080)

Low level stuff.

Guest (2:34:29.080)

Sometimes it's doing stupid shit that you're not uniquely qualified to do that anybody

Guest (2:34:34.640)

could do, but you did it anyway.

Guest (2:34:36.440)

Just the training environment.

Guest (2:34:38.380)

People hit me up at a, at a, at a school or wherever like, Hey, how do I get into, I want

Guest (2:34:42.840)

to grow my, grow my brand online.

Guest (2:34:45.200)

I want to do this.

Guest (2:34:46.200)

Like, where do I, where do I start?

Guest (2:34:47.440)

And I'm like, go get a job at planet fitness or 24 hour fitness.

Guest (2:34:52.560)

They're like, but I want to, you know, where, how do I get, you know, recognized and write

Guest (2:34:56.160)

articles and be an online coach.

Guest (2:34:57.760)

I'm like, you need to go spend a few years one on one training people to learn like the

Guest (2:35:05.920)

interaction, how people respond, there's base levels you have to do.

Guest (2:35:09.760)

You've got to go work your way up from the ground.

Guest (2:35:13.120)

Yeah.

Guest (2:35:14.120)

I truly believe it.

Guest (2:35:15.120)

Well, I think that's the hard work piece that I'm speaking to that I like it when people

Guest (2:35:20.880)

have been humbled by the hardness of life, like how difficult it is to do stuff.

Guest (2:35:26.960)

And it does, I went and got my MBA, I went to MIT.

Guest (2:35:30.040)

I don't need to do that stuff.

Guest (2:35:31.480)

I'm above that.

Guest (2:35:32.960)

Yeah.

Guest (2:35:33.960)

Yeah.

Guest (2:35:34.960)

And since you've been humbled by doing those things, I feel like you can truly explore

Guest (2:35:40.400)

the optimization that you're talking to, finding the ways where you're uniquely capable to

Guest (2:35:46.520)

add value to the world.

Guest (2:35:48.600)

And then, and then again, work your ass off to be the best in the world at that thing.

Guest (2:35:53.800)

Yes.

Guest (2:35:54.800)

So it's always,

Guest (2:35:55.800)

But then don't waste your time on shit that's not aligned.

Guest (2:35:57.800)

Yeah.

Guest (2:35:58.800)

That's the only, so that's, I guess there's a lot of context I put around that, but.

Guest (2:36:02.560)

Yeah, that was like a long answer to a, a long, beautiful answer to an unanswerable

Guest (2:36:09.840)

question.

Guest (2:36:10.840)

Do you have advice outside of all this discussion to young people today about career, about

Guest (2:36:15.520)

life?

Guest (2:36:16.520)

Since you've done so many things, you've overcome a lot of things.

Guest (2:36:20.880)

Think high school, college student, thinking about what to do in their life.

Guest (2:36:24.560)

Do you have advice for those guys and girls?

Guest (2:36:28.120)

Yeah.

Guest (2:36:29.120)

Yeah.

Guest (2:36:30.120)

First is you don't have it figured out, so don't worry.

Guest (2:36:34.160)

Just jump in.

Guest (2:36:35.160)

Yeah.

Guest (2:36:36.160)

Yeah.

Guest (2:36:37.160)

We talked, you know, a lot about understanding your values and aligning all that stuff, but

Guest (2:36:43.600)

you got to have a base level of start exploring and learning and just spending the time doing

Guest (2:36:49.720)

like pick something, let me elaborate a little bit.

Guest (2:36:54.440)

No, you know what?

Guest (2:36:55.440)

A lot of people struggle with that aspect now because the choice, there's so much choice

Guest (2:36:58.840)

it's difficult to pick something, but I think it does blow down to you should pick something

Guest (2:37:03.120)

and don't worry about it.

Guest (2:37:04.120)

And then, but within that you can start discovering the things that are there for you.

Guest (2:37:10.480)

Like I, I talked about, I made this huge shift, I threw away whole life, but I don't regret

Guest (2:37:17.480)

anything about that.

Guest (2:37:19.440)

I wouldn't be where I was if I didn't walk through and learn those things.

Guest (2:37:23.040)

And in fact, in the course of that, I learned just how much that inspiring people and helping

Guest (2:37:30.960)

them realize the potential far beyond what they thought was capable.

Guest (2:37:35.240)

And guess what?

Guest (2:37:36.240)

That was leadership 101 in managing people base level, floor level, right?

Guest (2:37:42.560)

And I got a lot out that was perfectly aligned with what, and that's what I realized.

Guest (2:37:46.360)

It didn't matter what industry I was in or any of those other things, but I was able,

Guest (2:37:54.340)

you can see so many things, there's so many paths that you can go down to help you realize

Guest (2:37:59.480)

what those things are.

Guest (2:38:01.320)

And you're going to be able to find a lot of those nuggets and develop those.

Guest (2:38:06.360)

Do you think that I could have just gone to school and got out and started a globally

Guest (2:38:14.600)

recognized brand within a few years without having been schooled in business while getting

Guest (2:38:21.120)

paid for it by others for years?

Guest (2:38:24.940)

And in fact, that entire time I knew that that's what I wanted to do, but I didn't go

Guest (2:38:29.080)

out on it.

Guest (2:38:30.240)

I mentored some of my friends along the same path to go, no, they're like, I'm ready.

Guest (2:38:35.240)

I'm ready to go do this.

Guest (2:38:36.520)

And I'm like, no, now you need to go get a job.

Guest (2:38:39.000)

Yeah, you know, engineering management, design, all that stuff.

Guest (2:38:42.160)

Go get a job as a manager now.

Guest (2:38:44.000)

Like, oh, that's a step down.

Guest (2:38:45.080)

I can't do that.

Guest (2:38:46.080)

I'm like, go try it.

Guest (2:38:47.080)

A couple of years later, oh my God, that was such a good move.

Guest (2:38:49.000)

I didn't know what I didn't know.

Guest (2:38:50.680)

And now they're an executive for freaking a fortune 500 company.

Guest (2:38:54.680)

And the same thing, like I sat there knowing that I was getting a free education.

Guest (2:39:00.320)

Don't stress yourself out as my, that's my advice.

Guest (2:39:03.800)

Don't stress yourself out that you've got to have this perfect thing because this process

Guest (2:39:08.640)

of understanding your values and the introspect, that takes time.

Guest (2:39:12.720)

You can get a job where you're getting paid to learn.

Guest (2:39:16.160)

Exactly.

Guest (2:39:17.440)

That's a good deal before you launch on your own.

Guest (2:39:21.240)

You mentioned going back to darkness.

Guest (2:39:24.040)

I'm Russian, so I like going back to darkness.

Guest (2:39:27.580)

You suffer from depression.

Guest (2:39:29.140)

You consider suicide.

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Do you ponder your own death these days?

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Do you think about your mortality?

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Are you afraid of death?

Guest (2:39:37.560)

I definitely think about mortality.

Guest (2:39:42.160)

And am I afraid of my own death?

Guest (2:39:44.920)

It depends on the moment.

Guest (2:39:46.440)

If I'm in the middle of a project, I definitely want to finish that project, man.

Guest (2:39:52.840)

But I don't fear it so much.

Guest (2:39:57.180)

I fear leaving my kids or my wife and not being able to be there for them.

Guest (2:40:09.440)

That bothers me.

Guest (2:40:10.840)

Outside of that, I know that I put everything into the life that I've lived.

Guest (2:40:18.840)

Like you said, there's always more, but I've lived hard.

Guest (2:40:24.160)

I've loved hard.

Guest (2:40:28.400)

Every moment in my life, I've made connections and impacted people around me for the better.

Guest (2:40:36.360)

And this tracks back, which is crazy when we were doing the documentary and they're

Guest (2:40:39.800)

interviewing people through my whole life and the consistency of the themes of anyone,

Guest (2:40:43.800)

like anything for Duffin, like just sure, I'll fly in from Boston.

Guest (2:40:49.680)

These people, it was crazy.

Guest (2:40:53.120)

Everybody had a story about me giving, just over and over.

Guest (2:40:57.640)

And I didn't even really.

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It's just the way you were.

Guest (2:41:00.760)

I've been all in.

Guest (2:41:04.360)

I have a lot more I want to do, but I don't have things that regret have not done in like,

Guest (2:41:13.920)

I don't fear it.

Guest (2:41:15.240)

I don't fear it.

Guest (2:41:16.240)

Yeah.

Guest (2:41:17.240)

It's like the, I don't know if you know the Bukowski poem, go all the way, otherwise don't

Guest (2:41:21.200)

even try.

Guest (2:41:22.200)

It seems like you embody that poem and you've accomplished some incredible things and serve

Guest (2:41:28.720)

as an inspiration to a huge number of people.

Guest (2:41:31.160)

Chris, you're an amazing human being.

Guest (2:41:33.080)

I'm really honored that you would spend your valuable time with me.

Guest (2:41:37.480)

Thank you so much for talking with me today.

Guest (2:41:39.160)

It was incredible.

Guest (2:41:40.160)

I can't wait to check out all the cool stuff you've engineered with Kabuki Strength.

Guest (2:41:44.200)

So I'm obviously, I love the, I love strength.

Guest (2:41:47.880)

I love strength training.

Guest (2:41:49.080)

I love the idea of strength.

Guest (2:41:50.200)

I love the equipment and the engineering approach that you take to strength.

Guest (2:41:56.600)

You're an incredible human, both on the things you've accomplished in terms of your own strength

Guest (2:42:02.520)

feats and the kind of science and engineering you bring to the field that many others could

Guest (2:42:10.080)

use.

Guest (2:42:11.080)

So thank you so much for talking to me.

Guest (2:42:12.720)

Thanks for having me on.

Guest (2:42:13.720)

That was quite the final thing.

Guest (2:42:17.120)

Thank you.

Guest (2:42:18.880)

Thanks for listening to this conversation with Chris Duffin and thank you to Headspace,

Guest (2:42:23.760)

Magic Spoon, Sun Basket and Ladder.

Guest (2:42:26.900)

Check them out in the description to support this podcast.

Guest (2:42:30.400)

And now let me leave you with some words from Arnold Schwarzenegger.

Guest (2:42:34.720)

Strength does not come from winning.

Guest (2:42:36.780)

Your struggles develop your strengths.

Guest (2:42:39.560)

When you go through hardship and decide not to surrender, that is strength.

Guest (2:42:45.160)

Thank you for listening and hope to see you next time.

Guest (30:01.960)

The kind of singular focus required there is incredible.

Guest (30:04.520)

It's somehow some of the most beautiful things that humans can do.

Guest (30:10.320)

And it's not just that thing.

Guest (30:11.900)

So that's the thing.

Guest (30:12.900)

It's like, oh, that must be it.

Guest (30:13.900)

That singularity of focus, it's not like, here's it, because it covers a vast array

Guest (30:18.680)

of stuff.

Guest (30:19.680)

Like I was working with people, you know, all, well, yeah, all around North America.

Guest (30:25.880)

I wouldn't say anybody around the globe, but professionals coming in, working on different

Guest (30:29.320)

aspects of rehab and, and recovery.

Guest (30:32.800)

And like, I mean, I'm tapping all sorts of stuff in so many platforms from nutrition

Guest (30:39.560)

to drugs to, again, like, you know, various Chinese medicine, you know, as far as, you

Guest (30:47.120)

know.

Guest (30:48.120)

But also the humans in your life, just love and positivity and just inspiration, all those

Guest (30:52.920)

kinds of aspects.

Guest (30:53.920)

I mean, you probably would have done much more if you went outside North America and

Guest (30:58.920)

talked to some Russians, just between you and I.

Guest (31:01.480)

Some Russians.

Guest (31:02.480)

Possibly.

Guest (31:03.480)

They give you some, I don't know, there's some incredible strength athletes in Eastern

Guest (31:08.720)

Europe.

Guest (31:09.720)

Absolutely.

Guest (31:10.720)

I've got the best one coming in September to get fixed.

Guest (31:14.840)

So what do you mean by fixed?

Guest (31:17.100)

So I'm not sure what his particular issues are, but he has held the all time world record

Guest (31:21.880)

repeatedly for a long time and he hasn't competed for some time.

Guest (31:25.160)

And he just reached out saying he would like to come and have me take a look and see if

Guest (31:29.720)

I can get him fixed because he needs to return.

Guest (31:32.000)

Okay.

Guest (31:33.000)

So it's more injury centric versus like form and a fundamental centric combination of everything.

Guest (31:38.320)

Everybody always wants to focus on the output.

Guest (31:40.400)

How do you give me the fix for that?

Guest (31:42.480)

But it ties right back into all those other things, right?

Guest (31:47.200)

But yeah, the Eastern block continued to be a dominant force in regards to athletics and

Guest (31:53.460)

strength athletes without a doubt.

Guest (31:56.080)

Some of my big rivals in my competitive days were, that's who it was.

Guest (32:01.640)

Rivalry brings out the best in us.

Guest (32:03.560)

Can you tell me the story of your childhood?

Guest (32:05.520)

It's definitely outside the scope of the norm.

Guest (32:07.840)

Not today, maybe not 150 or 200 years ago, but my parents, highly intelligent people

Guest (32:15.880)

coming out of the Bay area.

Guest (32:18.900)

My mom was going to school to be a chemical engineer.

Guest (32:22.360)

She was a top, top student athlete, graduated out of her school.

Guest (32:25.980)

My father was a member of Mensa and my stepfather was just a genius, but not able to really

Guest (32:31.120)

function in society.

Guest (32:32.520)

But my mom was, she had some demons and some other stuff and just, she just said one day,

Guest (32:37.640)

she's like, I just don't want to be part of society.

Guest (32:40.800)

She still isn't, lives out in the desert, but has her minds, but she wanted to figure

Guest (32:48.140)

out a way to make a life outside of that.

Guest (32:51.360)

And so that's where we ended up is up in the mountains in Northern California.

Guest (32:56.840)

And a lot of that was them trying to get into successfully growing marijuana, which back

Guest (33:05.060)

in that wasn't legal back then, highly illegal.

Guest (33:08.080)

And in fact, those areas were, some of the areas where we lived were quite dangerous.

Guest (33:11.800)

So there's a documentary Murder Mountain that came out recently.

Guest (33:15.760)

If you watch that, you'll tie into my book, just the understanding of the stuff that I

Guest (33:22.160)

was talking about dealing with serial killers, human trafficking, police corruption, murderers,

Guest (33:31.060)

like just how real that stuff is if it doesn't capture you from the book.

Guest (33:35.800)

The book, by the way, is the Eagle and the Dragon.

Guest (33:38.000)

Yeah.

Guest (33:39.000)

Thank you.

Guest (33:40.000)

Yeah.

Guest (33:41.000)

I'm a terrible salesperson.

Guest (33:42.000)

Like I told you.

Guest (33:43.000)

But a good, it's a good title.

Guest (33:46.000)

I don't know if you came up with it, but, so yeah, we'll talk about that anyway.

Guest (33:50.740)

We're living by a stream off a meadow.

Guest (33:54.160)

There's no roads into where you have to hike in.

Guest (33:56.740)

And we've got beams lashed into the trees up above us because that's where our bedding

Guest (34:00.560)

is.

Guest (34:01.560)

Cause there's rattlesnake dens all around and six years old, I'm being taught how to

Guest (34:07.360)

capture and handle live rattlesnakes because that's what I need to do to be safe.

Guest (34:13.840)

And you can imagine six years old, sitting there with a live rattlesnake in your hand,

Guest (34:16.960)

grabbing it, you know, by the side of the head, controlling so it can't, can't bite

Guest (34:20.320)

you.

Guest (34:21.320)

And it's just wrapping itself around your arm and you're staring at like, it's only

Guest (34:24.820)

intent is right then is to kill you.

Guest (34:28.600)

Like that's it, right?

Guest (34:31.520)

You want to take a bath.

Guest (34:32.520)

It's filling up the jug in the stream and setting it out on the rocks during the, during

Guest (34:36.440)

the sun.

Guest (34:37.440)

So you dump it over your head and you know, not all the living was that way.

Guest (34:40.560)

You know, good part was similar to that tent living, living in a 16 foot trailer with a

Guest (34:46.120)

family of six, which is not much bigger than the space that we're sitting here.

Guest (34:51.840)

So we're talking hard winters with feet of snow on the ground, nowhere to go.

Guest (34:56.440)

I'm living in the back of the pickup truck and just a standard sleeping bag that we get

Guest (35:01.240)

from the Salvation Army, not the, not the blow zero.

Guest (35:04.120)

So I'm I'm, I'm not sleeping well.

Guest (35:07.400)

There's living in homes that were maybe condemned.

Guest (35:10.880)

There's no, no doors even on them, no electricity or running water or one or the other or both.

Guest (35:16.320)

And sometimes a little bit better by the time we got to high school we had a mobile home.

Guest (35:21.920)

So my stepfather had won a disability payment cause he had a broken arm that whole time

Guest (35:25.800)

from a accident a long time ago and finally got an award and got a down payment on this

Guest (35:31.640)

mobile home that didn't have again, doors on the inside.

Guest (35:35.120)

It did have running water, did have electricity, didn't have a kitchen, you know, the windows

Guest (35:38.840)

would crank close and open, but they wouldn't close all the way.

Guest (35:42.080)

So the trim them in with a plastic to be able to try to protect from the elements.

Guest (35:47.680)

That was my environment, like learning how to forge for mushrooms.

Guest (35:51.440)

I mean, there were summers I would send and my parents would be out, they were in the

Guest (35:55.160)

drug trade earlier.

Guest (35:56.240)

We got taken by the, by the police and put into foster care for a while, which ties into

Guest (36:05.600)

some of the stories with human trafficking.

Guest (36:07.720)

And honestly it's in my book, but it's really hard for me to talk about that stuff and obviously

Guest (36:15.480)

not all that's in the book.

Guest (36:16.720)

So but they got us back and we moved to Oregon and they stayed out of the drug trade from

Guest (36:22.480)

that time to ensure that they didn't lose us again, but quickly we kind of fell back

Guest (36:28.000)

into the same thing.

Guest (36:29.000)

So at that point it was learning about geology and starting to do mining and firewood cutting,

Guest (36:36.820)

but mostly the mining because Pat's broken arm chainsaw made a little tough.

Guest (36:40.660)

If you remember just the sequence of moments, do you, are you haunted by the darker moments

Guest (36:47.020)

of your childhood?

Guest (36:48.280)

Do you remember moments of simple joy and happiness?

Guest (36:53.840)

Outside of the living around dangerous people and the interactions that came from that,

Guest (37:00.200)

we were a family.

Guest (37:01.760)

Like we were a cohesive unit battling against the world together.

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We spent all our time together, work, play.

Guest (37:09.680)

I was there.

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I was helping raise my, my siblings or I was working with them and you know, it was a constant,

Guest (37:17.160)

like I said, we were very physically active.

Guest (37:18.960)

So you know, I had that in my upbringing, um, that plug for my shoe company, barefoot,

Guest (37:24.080)

B E A R I ran around the wilderness and bare feet all the time, you know, but it was, I

Guest (37:29.920)

had a lot of great moments and I'm thankful for a lot of that childhood once we take out

Guest (37:35.360)

the trauma and the other stuff associated with it, right?

Guest (37:39.760)

And so the connection that I have with my sisters, um, is, is, is huge.

Guest (37:45.680)

Um, that goes a bit further to cause I am kind of like a, a little bit of a father figure

Guest (37:50.040)

because I was at home raising them and then later I took custody of them, uh, while I

Guest (37:54.640)

was going to school because the environment at home deteriorated further.

Guest (37:58.000)

Their stepfather, stepfather, like I said, was, he wasn't capable of managing life.

Guest (38:03.440)

And uh, my mom had a mental breakdown and took off to Montana and he descended into

Guest (38:08.120)

madness even worse, uh, actually took my, my 13 year old sister and kicked her out in

Guest (38:13.880)

the middle of winter, a couple of feet of snow on the ground because he thought she

Guest (38:17.280)

stole his favorite cereal bowl, um, type.

Guest (38:21.740)

So that's when I took in and I was going to college, putting myself through college and

Guest (38:26.320)

I started taking custody of my sisters and raising them.

Guest (38:28.520)

So anyway, we're still like very, very tight family.

Guest (38:34.080)

Um, it took, there was a few years later in life, like that the connection with my mother

Guest (38:40.040)

was kind of broken.

Guest (38:41.640)

Um, I didn't speak to her for years because of her basically abandoning my sisters and

Guest (38:46.960)

me having to come in.

Guest (38:47.960)

But that we've worked through that as best we can.

Guest (38:51.000)

So you anger on your part?

Guest (38:53.240)

It wasn't, there might've been some anger.

Guest (38:56.480)

Um.

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Did you always love her?

Guest (38:58.480)

Yes.

Guest (38:59.480)

And I still do.

Guest (39:00.480)

And I'm so, she's taught me basically everything I know about strength and perseverance and

Guest (39:07.580)

living life on your terms and being able to create that.

Guest (39:11.780)

And so much of what I am is from that, right?

Guest (39:16.240)

We've all had to learn to be okay with the way she is because she is just blunt, but

Guest (39:24.340)

you know, she's the one that figured out that the human trafficking situation and got, uh,

Guest (39:31.720)

got the da involved and got all the, she's the one that I've learned a lot from her.

Guest (39:41.040)

And uh.

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Did you inherit some of the demons?

Guest (39:43.760)

Oh, most certainly.

Guest (39:45.960)

And I, it's something I've continued like in my father's side of has been really tough

Guest (39:52.260)

on that because some of it is just based genetic as well.

Guest (39:55.700)

So my, my stepfather made I think six or seven attempts on his life during his lifetime.

Guest (40:01.960)

One of those in front of me, uh, his mother blew her head off with a shotgun.

Guest (40:07.120)

Uh, her brother jumped out a window in LA, uh, their father did something similar and

Guest (40:13.080)

I don't know how far back it goes because there is no family except for me and my children.

Guest (40:18.480)

You spoke about going through depression yourself.

Guest (40:22.120)

Yeah.

Guest (40:23.240)

Can you, um, talk about some of the darker moments of that?

Guest (40:26.440)

Have you ever like many in your family, have you ever considered suicide?

Guest (40:31.800)

Yes I have.

Guest (40:33.680)

Yes I have.

Guest (40:35.720)

You've achieved a lot of exceptional things in your life.

Guest (40:39.660)

Can you talk about those early days of depression and how you overcame it?

Guest (40:45.120)

Yeah.

Guest (40:46.660)

So the things that I did that people give me accolades for are the things that I did

Guest (40:52.520)

selfishly to save myself.

Guest (40:55.460)

The things like taking custody of my sisters, being the person that everybody around, you

Guest (41:03.960)

know, the, the important people relied on the fact that I had to step to the plate and

Guest (41:09.040)

be present and be that person because if I failed, they failed.

Guest (41:18.220)

They would be like the people that I grew up with that are dead or in prison or on drugs

Guest (41:26.600)

and they're either way to one of those, right?

Guest (41:30.120)

That's where everybody ended and I wasn't going to let that happen.

Guest (41:33.980)

What about saving yourself?

Guest (41:35.760)

And so that's how in those early days, that's how I did it.

Guest (41:39.520)

Not saying it's the best approach, but it was survivor mentality.

Guest (41:42.080)

It was, I can't selfishly do that because I have them to take care of, right?

Guest (41:49.680)

And then that continued where I would keep putting myself in these leadership roles or

Guest (41:53.560)

other things and just always being this person that was at the center, at the hub that forced

Guest (42:02.800)

me to be there.

Guest (42:04.040)

And so it's only in the more recent, you know, last decade or so that I have had to really

Guest (42:10.680)

learn how to come and start confronting some of those demons and think, man, why is the

Guest (42:17.080)

guy so successful?

Guest (42:18.080)

Like, I mean, and we haven't talked about all the stuff that I've done, but like I've

Guest (42:23.360)

seen a lot of success in both business, leadership, athletics, academics, entrepreneurship, all

Guest (42:32.840)

these sorts of things, right?

Guest (42:34.520)

But if it wasn't for having kids and the same being in the position, I wouldn't be here.

Guest (42:42.880)

And that's just, that's the reality of it.

Guest (42:45.720)

And I'm learning to come and manage those as best I can.

Guest (42:51.400)

Learning to meditate into those things and really feel what the driver is so I can get

Guest (42:56.320)

to those root understanding and having some guidance doing so.

Guest (43:01.360)

Like if you've got mental health issues, this isn't something that you need to tackle on

Guest (43:05.000)

your own.

Guest (43:06.000)

Like having a professional that can help guide you on that introspective journey is something

Guest (43:11.680)

like, it's not like, hey, I'm big, tough guy.

Guest (43:14.920)

I can handle everything.

Guest (43:17.680)

You know?

Guest (43:18.680)

That's fascinating that you saved yourself.

Guest (43:23.120)

That's quite powerful to save yourself by having others depend on you.

Guest (43:28.480)

And so you can't fail.

Guest (43:30.660)

You can't fuck it up.

Guest (43:32.280)

And that's a reason to keep moving forward.

Guest (43:35.960)

But on the flip side, that's not addressing the darkness.

Guest (43:40.440)

It's not.

Guest (43:42.120)

And it probably not a sustainable strategy either, right?

Guest (43:45.460)

So I recognize these things.

Guest (43:47.360)

I don't know.

Guest (43:50.320)

Perhaps it is sustainable.

Guest (43:51.580)

Perhaps that, I mean, there's something beautiful about giving yourself basically in service

Guest (43:57.720)

of others and thereby creating purpose.

Guest (44:02.840)

And then it's almost like fake it till you make it and then you make it eventually.

Guest (44:07.100)

That is purpose though.

Guest (44:09.140)

That is purpose.

Guest (44:10.140)

I mean, you have to, to me, life is about taking your cup and how you choose to pour

Guest (44:17.120)

it out.

Guest (44:18.120)

How you choose to give.

Guest (44:19.380)

What is your purpose?

Guest (44:20.880)

What is that connection with everybody around you?

Guest (44:23.080)

This is, that's the intent.

Guest (44:26.380)

That's the life.

Guest (44:27.380)

That's what life is about.

Guest (44:28.760)

How are you going to help those around you?

Guest (44:31.040)

How are you going to help the world?

Guest (44:32.520)

Your purpose is right here, figuring out what this is and then how to do that.

Guest (44:37.680)

But at the same time, you can't let that run dry.

Guest (44:40.520)

So you have to make sure that you're filling that up.

Guest (44:44.320)

That's the other side, right?

Guest (44:46.560)

That's the other side.

Guest (44:47.560)

Yeah.

Guest (44:48.560)

We'll return to your engineering degree, which you're obviously scientifically engineering

Guest (44:52.800)

minded, which is fascinating.

Guest (44:55.360)

Your book is titled the Eagle and the Dragon.

Guest (44:58.880)

What do the Eagle and the Dragon symbolize?

Guest (45:02.320)

They're pretty big symbols for me.

Guest (45:03.840)

In fact, that covers my entire body as a tattoo.

Guest (45:07.520)

So the first one I had done at around 19 years old.

Guest (45:11.320)

And so this is, or started at 19.

Guest (45:14.200)

It's an eagle that covers my entire front, you know, my stomach, rib cage, and one that

Guest (45:21.040)

was on my back that covered most of my back.

Guest (45:23.000)

And there's chained at the, well, at the claw, I guess.

Guest (45:29.080)

And the chain wraps down around and attaches to my ankle and there's a shackle there.

Guest (45:33.640)

And so this was something that I had done at that age because it was, to me, it was

Guest (45:37.760)

a representation of your potential, your strengths, your abilities that you can fly to whatever

Guest (45:46.120)

height that you want in this world.

Guest (45:48.680)

The only thing holding you back at the end of the day is yourself.

Guest (45:53.340)

And this was, I hadn't necessarily accomplished a whole lot at that time.

Guest (45:57.400)

I mean, I was valedictorian for high school, small high school.

Guest (46:02.080)

Does that even count?

Guest (46:03.080)

I was a state level wrestler.

Guest (46:06.840)

This was my belief.

Guest (46:08.960)

And you sense that there was a potential in you and the only thing that could stop you

Guest (46:13.280)

from realizing that potential was yourself.

Guest (46:15.640)

That's right.

Guest (46:16.640)

That's a heck of a tattoo to get, by the way, at 19, but 40 hours went into that thing.

Guest (46:24.320)

It shows you got some guts.

Guest (46:26.400)

And then the next tattoo, so I only have two, I had done in 2015, 2016 when I, so at this

Guest (46:38.720)

point in my life, so I had done that.

Guest (46:41.120)

I had flown to whatever heights, right?

Guest (46:42.640)

So I had, I had proven to myself and maybe done what I thought I needed to do to show

Guest (46:50.160)

the world that this poor kid from the sticks, this kid growing up in the mountains with

Guest (46:56.060)

nothing could achieve the American dream.

Guest (46:59.280)

I was a corporate executive sought after that I'd come in, I'd fix companies, I'd turn around

Guest (47:05.960)

and prep them for sale.

Guest (47:07.320)

I'd take a company and grow it from a regional to a national to a global presence.

Guest (47:11.500)

I did this in the automotive manufacturing, aerospace manufacturing, high tech, heavy

Guest (47:16.400)

industry and I had a house with a white picket fence.

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I was a successful athlete with all time world records.

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I owned a gym on the side where I coached people and I had a comfortable marriage that

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everything was hunky dory with no arguments at home and I walked away from all of it.

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I left everything behind except for my kids.

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I wanted to chase what I was meant to do and chase what I was capable of doing.

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I wanted to become a better version of myself, but very intentfully and that's what I did.

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I sold, I had multiple homes, sold my homes.

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I cashed in all my retirement that I'd earned for 20, nearly 20 years and I lost all that.

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I leveraged myself millions of dollars of personal debt so that if I failed, there was

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no way out.

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Even going back to that old career that I did well, I'd be living in an apartment the

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rest of my life paying it off.

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Old question, people questioned me at the time because I had a comfortable, easy marriage

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and I chose to ask for a divorce and I ended up living in an apartment for a couple of

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years with no income, selling off every last thing that I had except for my two vehicles

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that I built and with my kids and I started my businesses to help people live a better

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quality of life, to get them out of pain, to help them live better through strength,

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to realize that stress, demand, those things, they don't have to be the thing that if you

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look back, made you had the bad back, made you have the bad deeds, but they do the opposite.

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They get you out of pain and then I started working my book to hit on those other things,

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the mental, the emotional, maybe even spiritual, I don't touch on that one too much in there,

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but it's all the same, that things that happen around you, to you, like maybe they're bad,

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I can't take away that, but why can't you use what you have of it to become a stronger

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and better person, to become more resilient, to be able to take the things that you don't

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know that are coming in the future and so this is very intentful and that's what the

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second long winded answer in your question here.

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The dragon.

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The dragon.

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The dragon is an Ouroboros and so it is, it circles my entire upper body, my shoulders,

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my back, my chest, everything, it's right here, there's this big dragon head and its

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tail is right there in its mouth that's eating itself and it may sound a bit graphic or whatever,

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but it is, it's the eating of the old becoming the new, it is the purposeful reinvention

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of oneself, it is the deciding, not realizing just your potential, but deciding specifically

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who you want to be in this fucking world and becoming that person.

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Can you comment on the value and the power of putting a flame to your old life, your

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old self, just destroying all of it as you walk into the new life, did you have to do

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that?

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I don't recommend this, by the way, because when you put yourself in no way out, there

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is no way out, okay?

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You got to really, but I can be an overconfident individual at times and I live through extremes.

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I think it's a great way of actually finding your real values and how you want to live,

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honestly, to chase having absolutely perfect squat technique, but chase putting every freaking

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thing that you've got in it, which most people would say, those are opposite, those are diametrically

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opposed.

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I wanted a better home life, I wanted to do more in the world through my work and the

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burning the bridges mentality is not necessarily the best.

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There was some temperament in that though, because I was slow to make the shift for a

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long time because I'd been thinking about doing it, but I was thinking about doing it

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in a healthcare perspective.

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I'm going to go back to school to be a surgeon or a physical therapist or a Cairo because

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that's where all my research and stuff was in this human movement and rehab and recovery.

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This is the mentors that I've been developing were the best in the world in these things,

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in these disciplines, those were my friends, but I wasn't able to compromise my family's

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certain quality of life.

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I wanted to keep that.

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So it was slow and hard for me to make that transition, but I didn't do it until I had

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a platform built enough that those first few years I did have an income, I was able to

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make enough from the business until it grew so fast that I needed so much more needed

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to come in.

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The living in the apartment piece and doing all that, that was actually a couple of years

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into that process, maybe like two years.

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I'm with you on that.

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So I'm actually going through that very process now.

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I put everything, I quit everything, gave away everything and starting a new and unfortunately

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or fortunately this podcast somehow became quite popular.

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So it's getting in the way of my burning everything to the ground.

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But in that it's a source of joy.

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But the main thing I'm after is the similar project as you is building a business sense

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of joy.

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So this, this is the point I want to drive home right now, right now.

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Because when I say burn, I learned that burning the bridges works because that's how I had

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to succeed when I was earlier.

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The bridges weren't burnt.

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They didn't exist.

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There was no couch to go home to.

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There was no, there was no fall back plan and it forced me and gave me the confidence

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to know that I can pull it off.

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But I don't encourage people because there's so much out there of this hustle porn and

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other stuff going just grind, just go after it, get in and start your, like you'll get

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there and it's all about the output to make money, to be somebody, to do this.

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And I'll tell you what, that is some short term motivation right there.

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I feel like dropping a few swear words, but

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You're always welcome.

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We've already done a few, so we'll bounce it out.

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That is short term.

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That is not going to keep you going.

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This need, if you're going to go that approach, it needs to be because this is your North

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star.

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There's going to be so much hard work.

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There's going to be years of just pushing through where your question, not only is everybody

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around you questioning you and your family's questioning you, you're questioning yourself

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going, man, I don't know if I can pull this off.

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You're going to be stressed.

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You're going to be pulled to the max.

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If somebody comes up to me and says, should I start a business?

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I'm going to say no.

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And oh, you're supposed to motivate me.

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If you need me to motivate you, this is the wrong damn approach for you.

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This is going to be hard.

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This is going to be harder than you expect, even with me telling you this.

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And so it better damn well be worth it.

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This better be your North fucking star.

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This better live and be a way for you to be able to articulate or realize those values

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that you want to live.

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This isn't something to make money.

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This is a way for you to live the life and be able to share the values that you have

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with the world.

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And that's what it is.

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And if you don't have that, which is going to give you joy, then we can walk away.

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This is not some way to make some money and be known.

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I mean, this, this includes both like simple day to day joy and also deep meaning the whole

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thing.

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It allows you to overcome all the, all the pain along the way.

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But I got to say, I mean, it's a difficult thing because you run a business.

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This podcast and a lot of things I do research wise is full of joy, but it's simple.

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Running a business is hard.

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So it's something that I'm very hesitant about in that to almost push back a little bit.

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I think if I do get the guts to start the business, it will not be because I'm not choosing

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a more joyful life because I'm already truly happy.

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The reason I'll choose is because I just can't help it.

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There's this, I've always had this dream and I know it's going to lead to suffering and

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I know it's going to be a life that has less happiness in it.

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As sad as this to say, but it won't be, it won't be less happiness because we talk about

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this cup and where you choose to pour it and what you choose to do with it.

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And when you look back on things, the things that are going to give you the most joy, the

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most proud, the things that are going to stand out in your life that you really remember

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are going to be those days and your, those years you struggle, you're going to look back

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on 10 years later and go, fuck, those were the glory days.

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Those were the glory days.

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And it won't feel like it at the time.

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So that's what life's made of.

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And so this is your, this is your opportunity.

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You feel that.

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So right now you've got this, when you think about it, you've got this little thing twisting

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up in your gut, right?

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It's like, it's a mixture of anxiety and fear as well as excitement in that is that's your

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signal that this is your opportunity for that personal growth, the challenge yourself.

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This is your going for a run or working out in the heat.

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It's it's those things.

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It is your opportunity to go back.

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Maybe it even fails.

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Maybe it even fails, but by turning into that, you're going to learn so much and it's going

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to make you so much better.

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And it's the path that you should take when you have this stuff rolling around in there.

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And I don't, it could just be a hard conversation with your partner or your boss.

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It could be taking on a project that, you know, you know, that your boss has thrown

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out to the team and you're like, Oh, I'm going to hide in the back.

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I don't want that one.

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And it's like, maybe, maybe you do.

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Maybe it's going back to school.

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Maybe it's making that career move that you always wanted, but you're just a, you're just

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afraid of all these things.

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Those are your opportunity for you to turn into that.

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It is your workout.

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It is your practice because if you don't, you'll get soft and who knows what's coming

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and you're not going to be ready for it.

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And it's going to run right over the top of you because you're going to be weak.

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You're going to be soft.

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There's some aspect in which choosing that hard path is actually the, the way to arrive

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at the richest kind of happiness, the greatest fulfillment.

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That's the funny thing about just the human.

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Just make sure you're filling the cup as you're going through it and not pouring it all out.

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So that's the part to figure out, right?

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Sure.

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Well, life is short anyway.

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Eventually, eventually the cup will be empty.

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So maybe time the refilling of the cup correctly so you maximize the little time you got.

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Let me talk to you about strength a little bit first, high level.

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What are the differences in the different disciplines of strength?

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So power lifting, we talked about maybe just to clarify for people, power lifting, Olympic

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lifting, just regular gym fitness, bodybuilding, doing curls in front of the mirror for hours

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like I do.

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What's, what's the difference between all of these?

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Oh, and also strong man.

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Every one of those, as far as the athletic disciplines are different qualities.

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So we want to think about things as terms of quality.

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So there's strength, there's power, there's endurance, there's the ability to be coordinated

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and athletic.

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There's all these things and they're different, they're different qualities.

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So your training as it relates to that is how you cycle in the development of those qualities.